Bad Week for Big 12, How Many Teams Can Win the Title?

Welcome to the show.

Others receiving votes.

Uh, I'm Pat 40 joined by my Sports Illustrated colleagues, Ryan Fisher and Kevin Sweeney.

And gentlemen, I'm gonna give you a little by the numbers countdown, get us going here today.

Uh , 5 unranked teams beat ranked teams Saturday.

4 field stormings at Cincinnati, at Central Florida, at Wisconsin, at South Carolina.

You could add a 5th from Thursday night at App State.

3 unbeaten teams left in the entire country.

We're still in October.

We only have 3, UCLA, Utah, Miami.

2 1-loss teams left in the SEC.

Forget undefeated teams, there's only 2 1-loss teams left in the SEC.

One hot mess of a season, and we get to talk about it.

So this is awesome.

Um, another spectacular day in college football, fun, drama, stupidity everywhere.

Uh, it was great.

And it did make me think.

As I was watching all these field storms, guys.

Does 2 loss Cincinnati, 2 loss Wisconsin, Central Florida, South Carolina, do they need the hope of a 2014 playoff to have a good time on a Saturday ?

Or were they having a pretty good time as it was?

You win a big regular season game that means something and does damage to another team's playoff chances, and you go storm the field, and you're partying like mad people all day and all night.

I left, I stayed late at Cincinnati.

I was there, it was a noon kickoff.

They win, they stormed the field.

I stayed cause I wanted to watch the end of the utter fiasco between BYU and Central Florida, and by the time I left, it's like 7:30, the game's been over for 4 hours.

That campus was still going crazy.

Now, maybe because it's almost Halloween and it was a nice night, that would be the the result anyway, but I have to think winning that game put a little extra juice into things.

And I will say, You don't have to hold out this thin reed of hope of we might actually be pretty good cause we could be the number 24 team in the 2014 playoff, to have an enjoyable regular season.

That's today's stump speech, today's lament about where we're headed.

But, uh, generally speaking, guys, your first just reactions on the weekend that we saw, Kevin.

I mean, it was the perfect example of, it's never easy and never fun to go on the road in college football, right?

Texas Tech, Cincinnati, great example, BYU versus UCF, great example.

Tennessee and South Carolina, great example.

Um there's, there's more I'm missing, right?

At the end of the day, uh, that, that, that was, that was a week of traplines from Las Vegas telling you, man, only 7, really?

You, you're sure BYU is only 7 point favorites against UCF?

No, no, that, that there's a reason why.

And it's partially because of those atmospheres that you spoke about, Pat.

I mean, it was electric throughout college football.

There were some insane environments that lifted, I, I thought lifted results in a lot of cases, but um it it was the latest example of, of the parody we're experiencing.

Um, I know that is a, a boring cliche to bring up on a college football podcast these days, but, uh, it, it does increasingly feel like the gap in every conference, right?

Um, whether that's You know , and, and we can debate individual conferences strength, but the gap between the top of the middle of the SEC, the top of the middle of the Big 12, the top of the middle of the Big 10.

It, it, I'm not sure it exists right now, and Who's gonna find a way to win enough close ones to to to put, put themselves in this playoff conversation will be a fun one to watch in November, but I think we got reminded yesterday of uh the, the weaknesses and flaws of some teams that were, were riding pretty high coming in.

Yeah, I mean, it's almost like there's, uh, you know, a group of 18 to 24 year olds whose emotions swing wildly from weekend to weekend, uh, and that's what we base this sport on.

And, uh, I, I think, you know, the, the last two weeks, I mean, this, this might be two of the best weeks the sport's ever had, you know, just in terms of everything going on, you know, like all packed into two Saturdays, in particular, and uh you can throw in.

Some of those midweek games, you know, like the, the James Madison upset as well.

It was, uh, you know, crazy in terms of, yes, the, the college football race, and I do think there is an element to, to your point, Pat, that, you know what, as much as we like winning, as much as we celebrate, you know, success, man, giving it to another team and, and seeing them fail, that almost is, is just as good as winning, you know, and I, I think a lot of fan bases kind of look at that way, especially in a 12 team era when you can deal that loss, you know, and not only win, but Feel that loss to somebody else, you know, I think that does, um, kind of enhance some of the results and does add to the fervor from some of these fan bases in terms of, you know, what they were able to accomplish this weekend.

And, um, you know, there, there was a lot that happened, but, uh, man, it was, it was a wild and chaotic weekend, and, uh, I, I can't wait to get through it all with, with you guys because there was a lot, uh, and then we, we were in two of those field storms, Pat, so, uh, there, there's plenty to, to definitely get to.

Yeah, uh, I, I, I'm gonna further extend my point for a minute.

Central Florida's lost 3 games this year.

They're not going to the playoffs.

South Carolina's lost 3 games.

It would be an utter miracle if they make the playoffs.

Cincinnati, not going to the playoffs.

Wisconsin, almost assuredly not going to the playoffs.

But yes, to, to get those wins, and to have the wins mean something, uh, the, the Texas Tech, Cincinnati thing had some extra payload, thanks to Brendan Soresby.

But to deal that, that blow, as Brian indicated, uh, was, was juicy and enjoyable.

And we're still trying to, you know, as these conferences have been thrown together, and the Big 12 probably more than any of them, they're still trying to form rivalries and get a A, a body of work between two schools that makes them dislike each other.

And I, I'm, I think Cincinnati and, and Texas Tech are getting well down the road on that.

So, good for them.

Um, South Carolina, Tennessee, that's an old SEC East division rivalry, and it means a lot for one side to win that game, especially South Carolina, and especially the season it had had.

So, Uh, I, these are things that, that are products of the current system that I think would certainly be diminished or devalued.

I mean, Texas Tech came off the field like, oh my God, we might have ruined our season.

In 2014 playoffs, they're like, yeah, that was bad, but We'll be OK.

If we go, we go 11 and 1, we're fine.

Go 10 and 2, we're probably fine.

So, uh, it's just gonna be a different deal.

Um, Kevin, interesting, you, you mentioned the perils of going on the road, but man, this year had been, the home field advantage had really been diminished in, in conference play up until Saturday.

It was maybe the reminder that, no, it does still matter.

Um, the, the Big 10, the, the road teams were 19 and 13.

The SEC was 16 and 60.

So, it, it had been one more marker in a really weird season that even in unpredictability, got back to more towards what we're used to, which is those crazy home environments helping a team win.

Um, let's touch briefly on the Big 12, which, uh, really came into the, came into the week, we were all talking, oh, Big 12 looks great, they got 3 undefeated teams, they could have 3 or 4 playoff teams.

Well, they're down to 1 undefeated team now, Utah, which beat Houston, but Texas Tech losing and losing bad, and not having a good non-conference win, although beating Oregon State, more respectable than we thought.

Uh, BYU losing, the way that all happened, and we'll get into that, my God.

Uh, but that, that loss is not as bad, even though Central Florida is not very good.

But, uh, Brian, what do you think the damage was done there to the Big 12 from a playoff perspective?

Yeah, I, I'm just, uh, you know, picturing, you know, Brett Yourmark, and, and I saw him at the BYU Notre Dame, Notre Dame game last week, and, you know , he, he was, you know, jubilant and, and excited, and it was probably the, the one of the best weekends in the, in the Big 12 under his tenure in terms of on-field results, and you had all these undefeated teams and game days visiting, you know, both two campuses back to back there in Salt Lake and Provo and, and then boom, you know, reality hits him in the face and it was, it was a disastrous weekend, uh, for the Big 12, and you just look at the paths, you know, just.

The ability to for these teams to get top 25 wins is just not there like it is in the SEC or the Big 10, and I, I think that's gonna kind of end up biting them, you know, I think there's, there's a real possibility out there that, uh, you know, not only is this a one bid league, um, given some of the results in the SEC, but, um, you know, the results this week can contribute to that, um, you know, in terms of BYU falling.

I think Texas Tech was, was a huge one just because of the way the schedules are made, um, you know, like you, you felt like going into the, uh, after coming out of last weekend, uh, you kind of felt, oh man, uh, maybe the Big 12.

Did, did themselves a favor in terms of how they arranged the home road splits, in terms of how, you know, Texas Tech didn't really end up playing anybody, um, in terms of the other top undefeated teams in BYU and, uh, and, in Utah until, uh, potentially making it to Arlington.

All right, well, now that looks like, oh, that's, that's actually a big mistake and, um, you look at the Big 12, I, I think it's gonna be, um, you know, some, some real tough, you know, we're we're gonna circle that, the holy war for sure, um, in, in terms of being key to potentially getting multiple bids because if BYU loses that game.

Uh, you know, at Utah, and then Utah suffers another loss.

I mean, you're definitely looking at a potential one-day league, even though I think overall the caliber of play in the Big 12 is actually pretty good, you know, I think Arizona is a good team right now.

Uh, you got, uh, certainly, uh, you see the kind of middle class of the league, the UCFs, uh, you know, I, I think even.

West Virginia, um, you know, has taken a step forward this year.

Um, you know, really, I, I think the overall level of play in the Big 12 is much better than it was last year, but, um, in terms of those playoff chances, man, it, it really was a, a, a, a tough weekend for the league, um, given the number of losses and, and who it was to, uh, by, by a lot of those undefeated teams.

Yeah, you were gonna have to walk a tightrope, right?

And for half the season they did, and then everybody fell off the tightrope this week, unfortunately.

Now, I don't think it's over, um, in terms of multiple bid Big 12, but, yeah, there's, there's a lot of fascinating things that come into play here.

Um, I am sort of rooting for Utah to win the Holy War and Notre Dame to lose to Miami, and then we have 10 and 2 BYU and 10 and 2 Notre Dame, and we can do the exact same thing we did last year.

Uh, that would be very entertaining, uh, to go through, so, um.

Yeah, that scenario is definitely in a lot of people's minds right now.

It's very, it's very much on the table at this point with the way that these teams have looked, but, um, yeah, look, I, I think.

The question with the strong top of the Big 12 was, who's really playoff caliber, uh, and who's just pretty good, and I do think to an extent, we've probably separated, like, I think BYU is a playoff caliber football team, they have a win that proves that.

I don't think Texas Tech has shown anything that proves they're a playoff caliber football team, right?

I talked last week that their offense has been improved, that fell apart, um, they were really bad yesterday against Cincinnati, um.

You know, I, I think Utah has shown some, I, I thought the second half yesterday, uh, for those that were up watching at the very late hour that it was, was very impressive from Utah.

Uh, it ebbed and flowed, but, like, when their offense is good, there's not a quarterback other than Trinidad Chambliss that can, like, zip the ball into windows out of nothing, the way that Devin Dampier did yesterday.

He was, he was fun to watch in the second half, and that, that building was, was terrific, but Yeah, I, I think, I think you come out of this weekend in the Big 12 feeling like Utah and BYU are the two playoff caliber football teams.

In the league, and you, I guess, then hope that.

Utah loses to BYU and they have 21 loss teams, and they both make it.

I think that's the easiest path, but I don't know, if Texas Tech keeps winning, maybe they get back, get back in there.

There's a path, but it, it definitely got a lot more narrow, and, uh, yeah, if you're Brett Yarmark, you're not thrilled about that, especially in a week where uh you kinda have the spotlight to an extent.

It was not the greatest schedule for either the Big 10 or the SEC this weekend.

Uh, there was an opportunity to make a statement for your big brands, and, I mean, I guess you made a different statement that you've got some parity, but I knowing how the narratives work, I don't think that's gonna land quite as well as it would in the SEC or the Big 10.

Yeah, yeah, parity, parity is a great argument if you're in the SEC.

It's not as great an argument if you're in the Big 12, uh, whether that's the way it should be or not.

That's the facts.

And so I, yeah, it, it was a damaging weekend for them, you know, the BYU loss.

We'll talk about the game in a second, but just, you know, that was, that was a classic hangover game from a team that put everything on the line to beat Notre Dame, did it in very dramatic fashion, flew across the country, like the setup was there for that.

The Texas Tech, Cincinnati game, that was just a beatdown.

That was a team that had full system failures I wrote about.

Uh, in a game that Cody Campbell predicted, Cody Campbell, of course, the billionaire booster slash president of the trustees slash loudmouth of Lubbock, uh, predicted on a documentary during the offseason that ended up weaving in the Brendan Soresby business, who, of course, had been at Cincinnati.

Transferred to Texas Tech, broke a contract to do it, got sued, wound up uh with a gamble in the middle of a gambling scandal due to a gambling addiction, is no longer playing college football.

Texas Tech went to the mat to try to make him, to get him to play.

That didn't happen, but Campbell on this documentary said, You know, it could have been handled better, couldn't have, didn't need to be handled so publicly, but the retribution will come when we're up 40 and throwing the ball on Cincinnati in the 4th quarter.

Oops, closer to down 40 than up 40, Cody.

So that was not good.

And the people in Cincinnati were absolutely loving that, and that's the one problem with Texas Tech.

Look, they've improved the program, and they've put the money in to do it.

They've got good players, but the, the mouthiness, this, the, the braggadocio that has come with it, without having yet done enough to be insufferable, OK?

You went to the playoffs last year, you got smoked.

Right now, you're probably not going to the playoffs.

We'll see if that changes.

I would tone it down until you actually win something of consequence.

Winning the Big 12, great, great, but if you aspire to be what Texas and Alabama and Georgia, and Ohio State and Michigan are, go do it first and talk about it later.

Uh, anyway, that was such a bad performance by Texas Tech.

3 turnovers, 13 penalties for 85 yards, and they had 2 holding calls that were declined.

They just didn't, they, they really, they barely showed up, and then they fell apart late in the, in the first half, and it was, it was over at that point, and Joey McGuire was like full of self-loathing in the postgame press conference.

It was actually, it was, it was really good.

There was no chippineness, no defensiveness.

It was basically like, we're terrible, go ahead and pile on us.

Just, just tell us how bad we are, we know it.

Uh, and he had Kirby Hocutt, the AD and Lawrence Shivanik, the president, sitting in the back of the room during the press conference, and everybody looked like, whoa.

This is really bad.

Maybe they'd already gotten the text from Cody saying they're all fired, I don't know.

But that was, uh, that was brutal for the Big 12.

The BYU loss, we'll see how punishing that is.

I keep an eye on Arizona.

I, I really like what Arizona has done, sitting there with 1 loss so far, and it's to BYU, uh, good program.

We'll just, it, it's gonna be really fascinating to watch the Big 12 shakeout just to see who gets to Arlington.

And then what their records are, and whether there's gonna be a shot for more than one bid there.

Uh, the other place where the, the chaos continues to reign in the SEC, as I said, there's 21 loss teams left, it's Georgia and Kentucky.

Which is ridiculous.

Uh, it's like preposterous that Kentucky is 7-1, 5-1 in the league, 3-0 on the road in the league, and has this opportunity in front of them.

First year, Will Stein, and then he and Bob Chesney are like the same guy in different places.

It's amazing, really, what they're doing at the same time, cause there's one undefeated team in the Big 10, and that's UCLA.

Um, I, Kentucky fell behind 10-0, then just came back and, and dominated Vanderbilt, which you would expect.

But the serial knocking off of each other is really, it's, it's, it's making it even more difficult to figure out who the heck should get into the, uh, to the playoffs or even SEC championship game.

We've got this uh Uh, Kentucky and Georgia with 1 loss.

Here's your 2-loss roster, Alabama, Florida, Mississippi, LSU, Tennessee, Missouri, Texas.

So those all, those teams all have 2 losses.

How do you figure that out, we've tried that exercise so far on the show.

It, it has not been easy.

I think it's getting harder.

Uh, my, so my question to you guys, looking at everything.

In this parody-driven, I, I, I, I don't care if it's a boring podcast topic, it's true.

Parrody is here, like it's maybe almost never been here.

How many teams can win a national championship?

What do you guys see?

How many would you, would you name?

It's hard because, like, the teams that we've mentioned that are riding high, like, I, Bob Chesney's done an unbelievable job, especially in a Diefenbach era.

I, the Bruins are not winning the national championship.

Feel free to clip me if I'm wrong in a few months, I will surrender to my Bruin overlords.

They're not winning a national championship.

Kentucky, Will Stein, yes, that team is, that team is playing outstanding football.

They're not winning a national championship.

So, I think you go back to the teams that have, uh we, we, we've trusted the most, even if they had a slip up like a Georgia.

I feel good about Georgia right now.

I, I feel, uh, I feel really good about Miami, I feel good about Notre Dame.

I think I feel good about Ohio State.

But I don't know the quarterback yet, so, uh, I mean, for you, you, you fall out of teams you really love very quickly, right?

Like, do you trust Indiana to win the national championship right now?

I, I, I don't know that you cannot because of Si, but their offense has some serious work to do based on the last couple of weeks.

So, You wanna trim the field down really narrow, and I think that's where I lean right now, is that it's, it's a very small group at the top with, with Miami, Georgia, uh, Ohio State, if quarterback is a disaster, uh, Indiana and Notre Dame, that's like, that's the group I feel good about, but If you told me you wanted to widen it to to a big group, because anyone can beat anyone on a given night, I wouldn't hate you for it.

Yeah, I'm, I'm kind of right there with you.

Um, you know, I, I, I think I'm a little more skeptical of Ohio State at this point and, uh, because of the quarterback situation, and I, I mean, that was always going to be a case where, you know what, they probably were not overall as good as they were last year or even the year before, but they had the talent, they had Jeremiah Smith that you could just kind of spam, you know, game after game and just keep throwing it to him.

And, and so you could, you could conceivably see them winning a national title that way in terms of Jeremiah Smith just carrying them, um , you know, over the finish line, especially.

And some of the potential matchups they would have faced in the playoffs, but man, the, the quarterback injury to, to Julian saying, I think that does kind of change their ultimate ceiling, um, you know, regardless of how, um, you know, whoever it is going to be taking those steps long term, uh, is gonna end up playing.

Like I think that's, that's definitely a limiter, um, for, for Ryan Day's company, uh , moving forward.

So, they're out, you know, I, I think Georgia is in that group.

I think BYU is in that group.

I think Miami is in that group.

Notre Dame is in that group, but, um, you know, beyond that, like, could you see Utah maybe making the, the national Title game.

Like, I'm not saying that's out of the question, but to see them actually, uh, holding that trophy up in Las Vegas, I, I think just given the, the nature of the, of how they play, you know, this is gonna be a lot of close games and a lot of coin flips and like, man, I, I, I just don't know if you can kind of live with that.

At some point, you do need to kind of put some distance between yourself.

I, I, I, I think Kentucky is the, the one I'm most curious about, you know, and I think they have a, they have a stretch coming up.

They, they got a Biden coming up.

Tennessee and Florida coming up.

That's gonna determine for me.

Are, are the Wildcats for real in terms of a real threat, uh, not only to win the SEC, which is crazy to think about in general, but to, to say they're a national title contender in year one , you know, under Will Stein, I think that's, that's, that's the stretch where I'm circling and saying, all right, this is, this is how we're gonna kind of prove, um, whether this is kind of a mirage, whether that, you know, what we're seeing in terms of the consistency.

Play in terms of what we're getting out of Kenny Mini, in terms of what we're getting out of that run game, maybe that's actually something that you can, can rely on, uh, for 3 or 4 games, uh, in, in the playoffs, you know, I think that that's gonna be where, uh, that's, that's an elevator or, um, you know, one that's gonna sink the Wildcats, but, um, it, it, it's a smaller group than I think we kind of anticipated, uh, being, you know, maybe even last week.

Definitely, that shrinks by the week, that's the problem.

I, I like, who is, is truly trustworthy, uh, right now?

I, I, I'm gonna say, sure, Miami, absolutely.

Georgia, yes.

Notre Dame, I think so.

After that, I, you guys mentioned, Indiana's, they, they're, they have found ways to win, and they , they are a, you know, size 12 ft width away from being undefeated on a play they should have been able to make, but boy, oh boy, they are struggling offensively.

Uh, UCLA , I love it.

Utah, I love it.

I just, and then maybe this is my fault with from an optics standpoint of like, can I see them holding up a trophy?

And is it hard because I'm just not used to seeing them hold up a trophy?

Or is there something really there?

Same with Kentucky.

Kentucky's + 14 turnover margin, + 1318 takeaways, only 5 giveaways, that's That's good stuff.

That's, that's Indiana last year kind of level turnover margin right there.

And that plus quarterback play, plus a, a coach that sure seems to know what he's doing, uh, is a pretty nice recipe as well.

So, I'm gonna say there's like maybe 5, and I, Kevin, I think as you said, like, we can say there's like 3 or we can say there's 14, you know, it's, it's, it is either a real small pool, or you just start looking and saying, well, All these teams have a shot.

And that's, I guess, kind of the beauty of it all.

But the , the problem with the Big 10 teams is, is quarterback, right?

Ohio State, we don't know.

We, we got to see them on the field without Julian saying, and then learn something.

UCLA hats off to them, making it happen with Ty Diefenbach, but can, is that sustainable?

Is that a, a full season, big game, uh, quarterback?

Situation where, where you can absolutely make it work.

I mean, he's been good so far, you know, not great, but, but good, good enough in relief against Oregon, and then as the starter against Wisconsin and Michigan State, where the defense is pretty well carried the day for them.

And then Indiana, boy, the Josh Hoover thing is, is scary at this point, if you're there.

Like, his confidence appears to be severely shaken.

He's throwing the ball high, he's, you know, he's just not been accurate on, he, he's got, I think, the best receiver tandem in the country.

And they're throwing it like, like they barely know what they're doing.

8 out of 1881 yards, first interception of the season uh against Michigan.

So, the quarterbacks in the Big 10.

That's, that's the big X factor there.

So, I, we'll say anywhere 3 to 100 teams can win the national title.

There's your there's your declaration.

Um, I did, I would like to talk about, speaking of like, I don't know what the heck happened, the, the BYU UCF game.

Uh That was the strangest thing I've seen in quite some time, even in a sport that generates strange every week.

But the end of the game.

UCF is, has played its guts out.

They're playing great.

Kudos to Scott Frost for having his team ready and having them perform at a really high level.

But what Frost did.

On 4th and goal from the 1, with like a minute left, there might have been a little bit more.

I'm trying to look it up right now.

To go for the touchdown in a tie game, instead of taking the lead, I found to be absolutely preposterous.

It ended up working out kind of.

At least by way of winning the game.

It didn't cost them the game, but it just made no sense.

And I think you're seeing a lot of coaches that, again, they hate to kick, right?

It's always sounds better and you look like you're, you're more of a gusto-laden guy if you go for everything.

Try to win the game.

Take the lead with a minute left.

I, I, I, I just don't think that that's a, a terribly avant-garde situation to, to, to think that way, but they certainly did not.

Um, and then, all hell breaks loose at the end of regulation, and we got the kicker out there, and the kick gets blocked, and the kicker gets the ball, and then gets his helmet torn off, in part because he didn't have his chin strap buckled.

I, I was watching before they brought him out, when they brought him out, and I said to somebody else in the press box in Cincinnati, I said, dude, put your chin strap on.

It's like in front of his mouth.

So, like, what what are you doing?

It sure looks like a penalty when they rip your helmet off, cause your helmet isn't all the way on.

Uh, and then they go to OT and, and Cincinnati, I'm sorry, Central Florida gets it done there.

But did you guys see that?

What was your reaction?

Do you disagree with me on Frost going for the touchdown instead of the field goal?

So I disagree on the, the late game.

I, I, I have my own issues with how Scott Frost managed like the But I, I thought the entire, like, run out the kicker, the extra 5 seconds, we're gonna, like, confusion, we spiked the ball when the clock stopped, I mean, that was incredible.

There was a lot of, like, mishaps there, but I actually thought that was the right call, and I think it played out exactly how you hope it does if you don't score, right?

Ideally, you score the touchdown, you put immense pressure on Bear Bachmeyer to go march you 75 yards to win the game and tie the game.

If you don't score, you're so backed up that the first few plays of the series are clock management and get out of our own end zone to punt, and we get the ball back.

So, everything worked out the way it should have for UCF in that spot.

You had a chance to go massively increase your chance to win the game.

And then, once you didn't do that because you didn't get the 4th down, then you just have to get a stop, which they're backed up so much that they're not gonna play aggressively.

So then we turn around, we get the ball back with good field position, better if their punter would have caught the dang ball, which is its own problem in in college football right now.

We all have our own, like, uh, Our, our, our, our own thing we just can't get over, some people it's kicking.

I can't get over the punt returns, not catching the football, especially in key spots .

They lost, like, 10 seconds of, of, of time and, like, 10 yards of field position.

It was, it was so asinine, I was dying.

Um, but that being said, like, they had to go a chance, they, they had a chance to go kick and win the game in regulation.

And then if not, they sell it overtime, versus you kick the field goal, maybe the scores a touchdown, maybe they just play for 3 and they go to overtime, but it's a lot more comfortable to go try to do that drive.

So I, I had no issue with the go for it spot.

I know it's aggressive, I know that leading the game matters, I, I, I thought it worked out OK, I thought that was the, the way you want it to go, um, but, I mean, that game, the, the end of that game, I mean, again, UCF wins the game, you, you never you never attribute it to one play, but, like, The roughing the kicker call in overtime was horrific.

Like, I do not know how you come up with roughing the kicker.

If you, if you wanted running into the kicker, I think it would still be wrong, but I would understand how he got there, roughing the kicker, the guy's, I, I don't understand how you could do the plant-like thing when both of his legs are already on the ground.

We can't say it's the plant leg.

So that was ridiculous, and then I thought there were two missed pass interference calls on BYU when when BYU receivers were getting hammered by UCF guys on that final drive in the end zone, so, I, I don't really know what to make of it, but, I mean, it was a perfect college football chaos.

Does anyone wanna win this game?

Does anyone wanna lose this game?

Uh, but big picture, I think that the takeaway is that If you can find a way to move the ball in BYU, which is not easy to do, but if you can do it.

Their offense is not overwhelmingly talented enough to kind of wipe you off the field, and so you're gonna have to.

BYU is going to have to play games on their terms, they did a great job in Notre Dame of forcing that game onto their terms, and I thought that.

We ended up with the opposite at UCF where that game was really never in their hands, and it was a constant chase, and BYU in a chase situation, especially without LJ Martin, is not where they wanna be, and they're very vulnerable when that happens, and, again, I don't think it changes that BYU is a very good , probably not truly elite football team.

I think your takeaway should have been that after Notre Dame still, but maybe, maybe everyone was a bit of a prisoner of the moment .

Huge win for UCF.

How we got there, I'm just throwing my hands up and saying, yeah, college football, I guess.

One, and, you know, Terry McAuley was the NBC rules analyst, was on, on, uh, on afterwards and on social media saying, hey, there shouldn't have been a 10-second runoff.

So I'm thinking, can we, can the Big 12 have like an officiating seminar this week?

Like, just get on a Zoom.

Here's how, here's how, here's how to run in a game scenario.

Like, please guys, like, can we get it right where we don't have to have statements issued by the conference.

At this point, or, uh, issues of, of rules analysts calling out, uh, you know, the, the rest of the Big 12 officiating, like, can we, can we please get to that place, um, you know, by next weekend.

Uh, that was kind of my initial thoughts, and I was screaming in the, in the press box to, uh, for Scott Frost to kick the field goal.

Uh, you know, I, I, I understand being tough and sending a message and trying to think, all right, this is one of those breakthrough, uh, wins where we, we can really, you know, Not only pull the upset and get the field storming and all that, but we, we can show the country who we are and, um, you know, I mean, it was the first ever top five win in school history.

So you, you understood like, all right, maybe we have that that momentum and we want to get it, but kick, kick the field goal, like know who, know who you are playing.

I think that that's gotta be a factor.

Like you, you want to put that on Bear Bockmeyer's shoulders, like to, to not only go 75 yards, but like, even if they get into the field position to get a, get a game tying field goal, right?

College kickers, man, like you, you can, especially from distance this, this year, like in, in, in those conditions, uh, in Orlando where it seemed like, you know, half the game was, was played under, under a monsoon, um, like, I, I mean, know, know the situation, know, know, know the distance, know who you're playing, like, uh, I think that would have been asking a lot of BYU to kind of march down the field to either.

Uh, get a game tying score or, or go ahead.

So I, I felt, felt like I was just, um, you know, losing my mind in terms of Scott Frost, uh, going for it.

I understand the thinking behind it.

Kevin, you kind of laid that out, but like, I, I, I was definitely in team kick, kicked the field goal, and then that just kind of led to all the chaos that that transpired afterwards.

And it, it was a weird kind of scene there for Scott, you know, after, you know, they're they're kind of interviewing.

him and he's surrounded by all these fans.

He, he was kind of like very nonchalant about everything, um, you know, in terms of the postgame interview, like he almost expected it, which maybe that's the, the inner confidence, but anybody who's ever seen, you know, Scott Frost's teams play, um, you know, from, from Nebraska and, and, you know, beyond, um, you know, understood that that was not, not a straightforward victory by any stretch of the imagination there for UCF.

Yeah, the spike, like.

The spikes and the throw out of bounds were like, the, and that was, have your quarterback prepared when he goes out on the field, and the quarterback is sitting there motioning like this, spike it, spike it, and apparently the, the response from the sideline was, yes, and so they killed 1 2nd off the clock with the first one, not really ideal.

Throw the second one out of bounds, and then 3rd down, bring on the kicker, and that's when all hell broke loose, but.

Yeah, that, look, so we have a majority decision, 2 to 1 against Sweeney, sorry, buddy.

But, uh, I, I, I understand the thinking behind it, but Everything Brian said, I agree with.

Take the lead, put the pressure on them.

You end up, you could have had a 19 yard kick to take the lead.

You ended up with a 40, 40, how many yard long kick that got blocked, 45 yard kick.

You had to, and you had to move the ball to get there.

Yes, not fielding the punt was bad, but you're, you're on your own 31 to start.

You could have been on their one kicking, you're starting this on your own 31, and you've got to move it like 30 yards.

I would say against, again, a not overwhelmingly offensively talented team, put the pressure on them at the end of the game.

But anyway, UCF wins, wins anyway.

Scott Frost, uh, doesn't get fired on social media.

Dave Dorn got fired for real at North Carolina State as losing to Stanford has become a fireable offense.

Last year it was Justin Wilcox.

This year, it's Dave Doran, NC State.

They lost on Friday.

It was a Friday night, I think, um, in Palo Alto.

Yeah, yeah, with a great uniform look from Stanford, the all Reds, the old Cardinal.

It was really good , and they played well.

Davis Warren's actually having a good season for them, but still, losing to them is bad.

It'll cost a job.

Dave Dorn, 14 years on the job, really did a good job at NC State in the big picture.

Made them competitive in the ACC way more often than not , won more games and he lost.

The problem, they, you know, they hit no high notes.

They never made an ACC championship game.

They were never a factor to make a playoff, any of that sort of thing.

But Doran goes down.

Brian, you wrote a, first of all, your thoughts on, on Doran, but you also, you wrote a, a successor list.

Are we really gonna have Philip Rivers as the coach there?

Tell us about it.

Yeah, you know, I, I, I wrote earlier this week, um, you know, well before the Stanford game, I was like, you know, keep an eye out on this potentially happening, you know, Philip Rivers, um, he, he's close with some donors.

Like, I mean, one of, one of the NC State's biggest donors, uh, happened to post a picture of, you know, him in a private plane with Philip Rivers this week, um, you know, so just FYI on that.

Uh, so, yeah, I mean, this is something that, you know, it was probably surprising a little bit in terms of the timing, um, you know, like I, I, I got to the Camp Randall press box and, um, you know, my phone immediately buzzed and I was like, all right, well, what, what's happening?

And, and obviously the, the announcement came there for NC State, but like, uh, you know, I, I am, I am hopeful that, you know, NC State fans will appreciate the Dave Dorn era.

Like he'll he'll be invited back sometime, you know, in, in, in the future.

He's the, you know, winning coach in school history.

Like at some point, they will, there will be some appreciation for him and what he did.

But yeah, I mean, this was, uh, you know, a case of just never getting over the hump.

And, um, you know, that, that, that frankly was his entire tenure there.

Like, yes, there were a lot of solid, good.

Years, you know, like where, where you won some some quality football games, but, um, you know, like even, even this year, the schedule just set up perfectly for them to go on a run.

You had a quarterback back in CJ Bailey, he said, all right, he can take that next leap and just, it never all came together , uh, all, all at once.

And, um, you know, I think that they definitely had some conversations about Dave's tenure, you know, last year at the end of last season, chose to bring him back, but, all right, this is actually, you know, we can kind of Reset a little bit, he, he would have been going into, I guess, 3 years left on his, on his contract and said, all right, maybe this is more of a, we're we're gonna determine where we're at.

And, um, you know, I think after that loss in Stanford, where, you know, you felt like the rug was pulled out from under you against a team that is firmly rebuilding with a new head coach, um, even though it was a cross-country travel, like, that was, that was gonna be rock bottom.

And so, uh, you know, the decision was certainly made by Boo Corrigan to Uh, to ultimately in the, in the tenure there, um, and, and you can understand trying to get a jump on this market because, you know, I, I think you talked with some.

And who else comes open, whether it's USC, Florida State, some of the other kind of big, big name jobs that could end up, you know, kind of moving the market a little bit more.

This is actually a really good job.

It's in a winnable league.

Um, you, you look at the, the resources there that they can have.

I think they can fundraise off, off of this quite a bit in terms of the roster resources that they can devote.

I, I think it's, it's a state of flux there in the ACC to where you say, there's a lot of winnable.

Games, no matter what schedule we get dealt with, yeah, we're gonna be at a disadvantage against Miami, but everybody else in the league, man, there's , there's a lot of winnable games out there, and, you know, in a, in a 2014 playoff era, let's face it, you know what, you go 10 and 29 and 3 against a schedule like that, you're gonna be in the playoffs, and you're gonna be maybe even hosting a game there in Raleigh.

So I think there's, you know, a lot of optimism about the program's future going forward, and yeah, I, I , I, I think.

You know, yes, you, you would say, you know, Jason Eck, you know, is tailor-made for, for a job like this.

You know, there, there's a lot of, um, you know, quality head sitting head coaches, including one down the road in Tobacco Road, and Jake Dicker that would be appealing, uh, for this job.

But, um, I think there's gonna be some real conversations in terms of, hey, Philip Rivers, not only are you a beloved alum, he, he would get the, the donors to open up those checkbooks, uh, he would get the fan base fired up around him.

Uh, you know, I think as, as a head coach, you know, we'll see what ultimately he is there, uh, and, and, and what his staff is gonna look like, but, uh, man, that seems like a situation where you could say, all right, in terms of maybe resetting the program a little bit, um, we really couldn't go wrong with, with this.

And so I think that there's gonna be a lot of internal debate in terms of, um, you know, whether this ultimately ends up happening, but, uh, I think the, the vibes there are strong to, uh, potentially go with, uh, with, with Mr.

Rivers and look, it's, it.

It doesn't hurt that, uh, you know, his son is a four-star quarterback that's also committed to the program.

So he's, he's intimately aware and familiar of both, um, you know, what it takes to succeed there and also what kind of the issues there are in the program.

So, fascinating situation there in Raleigh, and, um, you know, I can't, can't wait to see, see what ultimately plays out over these next couple of weeks because, um, it wouldn't surprise me if they, they go for the straightforward option or they go out of left field, you know, that, that, that could be, uh , kind of Bu Corgan's MO at this point.

Yeah, I think this will be fascinating from the standpoint that.

My initial reaction whenever I hear, let's bring back the celebrity, the former player, guy who's tied to all the boosters, is it's not a good sign that that's what it takes to get your boosters excited.

Um, if I'm If I'm, if I, if I'm Boo Corrigan, like , I, I, I, I want the same level of energy towards hiring Jason Eck as there would be to hiring Philip Rivers, in terms of, like, the big dollar people, right?

I understand that, like, the average fan might see more excitement in the legendary former player, maybe they'll buy more tickets or they'll buy season tickets that they wouldn't have before, like, I get that, but those are not the people you make decisions based on, you make decisions based on, people are gonna write, you know, 25 $10 million dollar checks to to help fund this thing, and It would concern me if I was NC State that it feels like that's what it's going to take to get that level of investment is, hey, like, we have our guy, so if, if you're gonna, if you, if you hire him, we'll be ready to go, and if you don't, we're gonna be skeptical, like, that, that is not a place I ever wanna be as an AD, um, but I also think Philip Philip Rivers, um, for as much as some of the quote unquote, celebrity hires have not worked in the past.

Like he interviewed for the Bills job last year, uh, he is very clearly on a trajectory to be a, a very real name in coaching, whether that's in the NFL or at NC State.

Um, it's just such a limited sample size.

I mean, it's, it's a zero sample size outside of high school football, uh, and that, that would be what makes me wanna say, hey, look, this is, this is a buyer's market, if you're a, you know, mid Power 4 program right now, there's a lot, there, there's a lot of interesting candidates for my level.

Um, maybe not a lot of interesting, like, blue blood level candidates, but a lot of guys are like, hey, if we have real resources, we can get something done, but My, my gut feeling would be that if the money wants to go this route, that that's the route they're gonna go.

Yeah, I, I think the money wanted to go the route of Will Wade, that worked out really well there.

Um.

It, it's fascinating.

This, there certainly it smacks of win the press conference and make the alums feel happy.

It doesn't necessarily mean you're guaranteed to win.

Uh, yeah, you know what, he's doing a heck of a job at Saint Michael Catholic High School in Mobile, Alabama.

Uh, and he does have his son who is the 4-star group there.

He's got like 100 kids, so he may have more football prospects on the way.

He could have his own recruiting pipeline, uh, if you go, you know, be like Dion coaching two of his kids in Colorado, who knows.

But, Yeah, I, I mean, I think he, he might end up being a really good coach.

It's just you are asking, you're taking a complete leap of faith that a guy whose sum total of his coaching experience is 56 years, I think, in coaching in high school in Mobile, is gonna step in.

Now, you know, all the NFL experience, he knows football for sure, knows what a good football team looks like, feels like, all that sort of thing, but it's different between being the, the charismatic quarterback and also being the coach, I think, so.

Pat and Pat, I think it's, it's important to keep in mind like the, the psyche of NC State fans.

Like they, they've been beaten down, you know, like, it seems like every time, you know, they, they are Charlie Brown, you know, with, with the football, uh, it seems like every time you, you, they're poised for a breakdown, you know, the rug gets pulled out from under them.

And even like in, you know, in basketball, I mean, we saw this going through in terms of Will Lade, uh, leaving, leaving the program like there was.

You know, a lot of existential angst, you know, around, uh, Wolfpack fans, you know, and, and, and everything happening in there in Raleigh and that they ended up bringing, you know, Justin Gainey, another alum back, another former player coming back.

All right, this is, this is gonna win, not only win the press conference, but it's kind of gonna make us feel something about the program that, that's gonna be different from what it was in the past.

So I think there's kind of some of those parallels, you know, in, in football in particular with.

This hired, you know, maybe they do land on an experienced head coach.

Maybe they do, uh, have those conversations with Philip Rivers.

He said, you know what, I, I actually just kind of want to see my son play football, uh, without the pressures of having to coach him, you know, like that, that's definitely, um, you know, a potential out there.

But like, at this point, like, this is, it's gonna be one of those hires that's gonna say, here, here's what we are as, as a fan base.

We just need something to believe in, and, uh, I think that would kind of do it.

Yeah, among teams are the programs that, that didn't necessarily win the press conference uh recently, Indiana, UCLA, I mean, nobody was sitting there saying, we just got the home run.

I mean, I think UCLA was probably pretty excited, but Indiana was just like, OK, we got the guy from JMU we're Indiana, what the heck?

Sometimes winning the press conference is overrated.

Um, So we'll see where that goes.

All right, uh, Brian, the, the other job that opened was Maryland, Mike Lockley, everybody saw that coming.

They got that one done.

Who's on the list to replace him?

You know, whether it's a Jason Eck, which I, I think he would be perfect, um, you know, like I don't, I don't see Wisconsin opening up at this point.

Um, so I, I feel like if he wants a Big 10 job, you know, this is kind of up his, up his alley, you know, in terms of a program that, you know, let's face it, the resources are not quite there, uh, in, in terms of supporting him.

He, he does more with less and , and And he's, you know, creative offensively, you know, he, he's gonna get, uh, you know, a lot of butts in the seats.

Jake Dickert, yes, I, I can understand, uh, the attraction.

I, I think he, he would be holding out a lot more hope for, for, you know, bigger jobs, um, you know, at this point, and, and then it's kind of any number of, of sitting coordinator, you know, Pat, I know you're, you're high on the Indiana coordinators.

This seems like a perfect fit for one of those two guys.

Whether it's Mike Shanahan, um, who, who's more of the offensive mind, uh, whether it's Brian Haynes, who kind of is kind of gritty, much different from Mike Locksley.

So maybe there you just kind of want to flip from, you know, maybe the players coached a little bit more hard-nosed guy, um, who, who knows the area from from his time at James Madison.

Uh, you know, I, I think it's understandable that, uh, that, that's kind of the, the caliber of candidate that, uh, the Terps are probably gonna attract.

Should, should Maryland be thinking about a parachute guy?

Like, like, like, should Shane Beamer be looking at Maryland and Maryland be looking at Shane Beamer, right?

Like, yeah, he was, he was on my list.

Like, I, I mean, you talk about resetting your clock, you know, like for, for a guy like Shane Beamer, like this, this could be one of those opportunities, and look, he definitely had some success down the road, uh, is well known in that tidewater area from his time at Virginia Tech, but like, Is this a potential reset opportunity?

Are those former head coaches out there, the, the Jimbo Fishers, the Brian Kelly's, you know, is this kind of one of those landing spots for them?

I, I think Brian Kelly's probably gonna get, uh, attached to this job, um, you know, quite a bit, but, you know, is this the right fit for him?

Was it the right fit for the school?

I think those questions are still out there, and I think it's something that truthfully, Maryland officials are probably still, uh, sorting out at this point.

Yeah, it's fascinating.

I mean, they, you could have a wide spectrum on that list, and the, the beamer thing would be, would be interesting.

Uh, he would do the one thing Loxley hasn't done.

He would, he would hit some high notes, he would, he would upset some people.

He'd win some games, he might lose a lot, but, but he might also, might, you know, he'll have a season.

He's one of those guys, though, as soon as you count him out is when he starts winning, as soon as you start building him up is when he starts losing.

It's classic.

He's, he's, he defies uh expectation, I guess you would say.

Uh, all right, guys, let's end this with our, our weekly Heisman and our firings.

Uh, Kevin, who do you, who do you want to fire this week?

I mean, we've we've got a, we've got a good list of potential candidates, but I thought, I thought Dave Aranda really dug himself a hole yesterday.

Uh , losing to Kansas, that was the game you had to have, but beyond that, I mean, uh, we talked about our, our, our things we can't understand how college coaches do, the play for the 50 yard field goal.

Like, what are you doing?

Like, they, they, DJ Lagway drives them right into position, they run the ball 3 times, I believe, in a row, to set up a 50 yard field goal.

Shockingly, it gets blocked.

I mean, who could have foreseen that perhaps a 50 yard field goal on the road by a college kicker might not go well.

So, that was a really poor, poor decision, and to me, maybe the nail in the coffin for, for, for David Aanda at Baylor.

Brian, I'm pretty sure I know who you want to fire.

Go ahead.

Yeah, I mean, you can, you can read my column at SI.

com, uh, about firing Lincoln Riley cause it is time.

It is time to have that discussion, and I think USC is going to seriously have that discussion, um, you know, it's probably as soon as next week, uh, depending on the results there against Ohio State because Like everything has been set up for Lincoln Riley to succeed, uh, you know, there at USC.

It's, it's been 5 years, you know, the roster is in a better place than it ever has been going back to maybe that, uh, Rose Bowl team with Sam Darnold.

Like, I mean, I think that's, you know, you look at the talent level, you talk with, you know, some, some, some scouts like this, this, they have the quarterback, they have everything in place, and man did it open up, like, you know, you, you play a backup quarterback in Oregon.

Yeah, we would have had a backup quarterback coming in against Ohio State, Indiana, not quite the Indiana that we expected.

That seemed like a winnable potentially winnable game.

Like, if everything opened up and then now you're probably looking at maybe a 7 and 5 season, you know, at this point, uh, for, for, for the amount invested, um, like, uh, Lincoln Riley, and, and not only was it the worst output, um, offensively that he had ever had as, as a head coach of 7 points like.

Wisconsin had 200 yards of total offense, and they blew him off the field.

Like in the USC just never got into that game, complete total no show after coming off a bye, no less, um, you know, and it's not like, um, this is like going into the horseshoe and you're, you know, like, uh, you know, I do feel like, you know, Camp Randall was like 80 or 9000 seats, um, you know, away from a, from a potential sellout, you know, maybe that's uh because of the Brewers game going on, um, you know, down the road in Milwaukee, but man, uh, everything was, was setting up for USC and then just, uh, completely fall on their face.

Yeah, I'm, I'm definitely firing Lin Riley and you can.

See more why in my column on on SSI.

com.

Yeah, check it out, unsparing, I would say.

Uh, I'm not really firing Dan Lanning, but I'm firing him today for this season.

What a disaster.

Oregon's 4-3 after starting the year ranked number 2, 2-2 in the Big 10, lost to Illinois, not a good Illinois team, shut out in the second half.

They scored 10 points and they were shut out in the second half.

Uh, Illinois won the game while throwing for 89 yards.

This was bad, very, very bad.

Coming off a tumultuous week, uh, Evan Stewart, top receiver, got arrested.

Uh, there's just, there are issues with this team, clearly.

Clearly, they have not put it together the way we're used to seeing a landing Oregon operation.

Yeah, the injury to the quarterback Dante Moore hurt, but that's why you have Dylan Rayola as the backup, and Royola was not the problem on Saturday, although they couldn't get him in the end zone .

But he threw for 246 yards.

Uh, they, that's just, it's a bad team.

It's a bad team.

Uh, with a tough schedule that's crumbling amid high expectations.

So, Dan Lanning certainly is not losing his job unless Phil Knight goes crazy, and that's not really the way he operates.

So, I, I think he's OK, but man, what a bad season for them.

All right, Heisman Trophy, where are you guys going there?

Uh, Brian, you have a Heisman Trophy winner.

I'm gonna go with Leno Sellers, who, who is playing way better as of late, and it seems like he, he's kind of found a groove, but 3 total touchdowns, uh, that, that one, you know, at the end where he just, he, you know, shows what leg day is all about, uh, to muscle into the, to the, uh, the end zone there, uh, you know, just incredible, um, you know, he, he has carried South Carolina, you know, it seems like they, they got two guys that are.

You know, first round picks on either side of the ball and like they're they're just like turning them loose.

Like you guys are gonna go out there and win us a game.

They did against Tennessee and, uh, you know, incredible to see.

And now you can definitely see not only a path to to to a bowl game, but, um, you know, maybe, uh, you know, South Carolina is gonna be a frisky team, uh, for anybody else to play down the stretch run, given how well, uh, you know, their quarterback is playing at this point.

Yeah, I, I don't know if there was a play this year that was more impressive, like, physically than what he did there.

I, I like that, you watch a lot of college ball, you see some stuff, that, that was a new one.

I'm giving it to Drew Messenmaker, um, because I think he actually belongs much more seriously than the Heisman conversation.

Then I think he has been given credit.

I mean, this guy is unbelievable , night in and night out, 4 touchdowns yesterday against Colorado, their offense puts up 57 points, it's starting to look like North Texas, uh, except Big 12 North Texas, uh, 386 yards, uh, I mean, he has been absolutely incredible to watch, and, again, this is an Oklahoma State program that is very much still in rebuild mode, and he is willing them to win right now.

Interesting stretch of schedule ahead, but if, I think if they get to, like, a 9 and 3.

I think Drew Massammaker should be in New York because of his impact.

I'm not saying he'll win it, but he should be a lot more in the conversation than I think he is right now.

All right, uh, I am going off-brand here, deep track, but I'm going to two guys from the same game, Rice against Florida Atlantic, and I don't know how many people were there, probably not many.

I don't know how many people watched the game on TV.

Probably not many.

The defenses were probably horrible, but Unbelievable individual performances once for one or one player on each team.

Gay Ochoa, backup quarterback for Rice.

In 2 seasons, 1.5 seasons of college football, he had rushed for 13 yards total.

Against Florida Atlantic, 12 carries, 259 yards, 4 touchdowns, all of them longer than 50 yard runs.

Like he just went crazy.

He tore through the defense, they threw the ball, he threw, he was 2 for 5 passing for 80 yards, but a touchdown there, threw a 71 yard touchdown, so he's just like Mr.

Big play out of nowhere.

He had not played very much college football.

I think we have the new running quarterback in this game.

I, I'm like totally blown away by Gayle Ochoa, but then on the winning side, Easton Messer.

Receiver scored 2 touchdowns rushing, scored 2 touchdowns receiving, including a 68 yarder, and for good measure, threw in a touchdown punt return 82 yards.

So he scores 5 touchdowns in 3 different ways.

Him and Gayle Ochoa put on like the I, I, I don't know, there's like, I don't, like, Jerry Rice against Barry Sanders game out of nowhere in the bottom half of the, the American Athletic Conference.

So you guys, you, you, you, you can share, uh, my, my Heisman, all yours.

All right, everybody, that's the show for this week.

Uh, thanks for listening.

We will have much more to overreact to every week from here on out, if the, the stakes keep rising, uh, stuff will keep happening.

We will keep chronicling it, and, uh, have a good week.

We'll talk to you next Sunday.