In The Corner: Oscar Willis Breaks Down Conor McGregor's UFC Return

I really wanna bring in our, our guest today because he is the perfect person to talk about IFW with.

We've got Oscar Willis, who is an icon in the MMA media world, iconic voice, iconic figure, just an icon in general.

Yeah, the way he moves, you know, it's just, yeah, he's great and he works, um, he works for MacLife, right?

He runs MacLife, um, which is Connor's publication.

Um, I've gotten to know Oscar the last few years, and he's the most traveled MMA media.

He's literally been to every, every corner of the earth covering this sport.

Um, I've been, I've been fortunate enough to get friendly with Oscar, and we got to share the South Lawn of the White House together.

Um, we'll maybe hit on that when he comes in, but yeah, really looking forward to everything he's gonna say.

I say we bring him in now that way we can get into everything IFW and everything Conor McGregor.

Let's do it.

We've got the most traveled MMA media member, a voice that you guys know and love, the one and only Oscar Willis.

What is up, my guy?

Thank you very much for having me.

First of all, it's good to know that the travels.

Finally paying off.

All I had to do was trudge myself around this planet 800 times to get that recognition, but yes, it's great to be here, thank you.

What did you think of that intro, that was a good.

Very nice.

The producers called me iconic.

Iconic voice is what Matt said.

what I thought of it, every time I hear myself speak, I go, God, puberty around the corner, puberty round the corner, boys.

But no, it's cool.

Well, I mean, we've got you in this, in the studio because we are just a week shy of a really big week, a big one in the MMA world, we've got the return of Conor McGregor.

Yes, yeah, it's um, I was thinking actually about it earlier, like, you know, sometimes in this sport, combat sports, but any sport in general, you know, people can disappear very quickly from the, the memory and the mind of fans, and yet this guy.

Pops in, like for example, Floyd Mayweather, Manny Pacquiao 2 was announced, whether it happens or not, another story, but that was announced, and I don't really feel like there was much fanfare around that.

Conor McGregor comes back , it's like he didn't miss a day, you know, the analytics on everything we post, everything just feels like, oh wow.

He's back and um I don't know quite how he's managed to get that star power, but it's, it's cool for the sport to like have it back, you know.

Yeah, absolutely, yeah, for sure, and I think, like you said, 5 year absence, so I think let's, let's pull back and just, how did you get involved with Mac Life, your start in MMA media, your start in media in general, so.

I was uh uh I was a builder in London, like a construction worker.

Fairly miserable.

uh I wasn't very good at it.

I don't see.

No, no one does, including the employee, other employees.

um, but it was raining one day and I just said to a kid that I was working with, I said, where's sunny, like where in the world has sunshine?

And he said Florida, and I said I'm gonna move to Florida, so I, I applied to university in Florida, got in to study journalism, I told the man, this was in 2012, I told the embassy, like the visa guy, I wanna go to study journalism in America cos MMA's big there and there's nothing here.

So that was always kind of the dream goal.

I used to watch Hilwani and MMA fighting and stuff like that and sort of be like, oh, could you imagine, and um English was like the only thing I was ever good at at school.

I was very, very bad at everything else, that's why they asked me to leave a little bit early.

You are very well spoken.

Thank you.

Yeah, that was the only thing that stuck apparently.

Um, but basically got, got over here, loved MMA, studied journalism, and then halfway through my journalism degree, I saw this website, the Mac Life, pop up.

And I was a massive Connor fan, like crazy Connor fan, to the, my friends would make fun of me, like, oh why don't you go fucking kiss the Irish guy you love so much, it's like they're crazy.

And I emailed the MacLife and said, you know, what does Connor have to do with this, they said he owned it.

And I just sort of was trying to be like cheeky, like hey, if you need a writer, and I basically got there first before anyone else.

And they said, yeah, go on, and they, we'll give you a test run, and uh I just felt.

If I didn't give them a reason to fire me, they could never fire me, so I would like write, I'd, the first year I would set an alarm for every 45 minutes through the night so I could wake up to check if there was any news that had broken .

So, so I'd write an article about it.

I'd run into the bathroom at university and write articles on my phone, stuff like that.

Like the first year I was a little overly crazy, but.

That's what, that's kind of what it requires to get to where you are in the game, especially working with somebody such as Conor McGregor, uh, like kind of a dream come true.

You were a massive fan and then just it was very surreal.

It was crazy.

Uh, how old were you?

I was 24, I think.

Oh my goodness, yeah, yeah, I was 24.

It was right as, uh, right, I, I, the first fight I was working for them was his second fight with Diaz, so like kind of right in the, the, the, at the, at the, the peak, um.

And I remember meeting him during the Floyd Mayweather media tour, and being like, this is pretty cool.

And I, I actually had a selfie with him, and he said you do great work, I was like, he knows who I am, uh, and I, I sent, I sent the picture to my friends and I was like, fucking who's laughing now, but yeah, it's been good, it's been cool.

So how did you kind of, cos obviously you're much more than a writer now, how did, how did your kind of career arc.

Like, go once you started at the Mac Life.

As we were trying, so I was originally just a writer, and then as we were trying to grow what the Maclife, well, you know, to be fair, when it started, we were kind of like, what is this, you know, we didn't really know, and then originally it was like a Conor centric video blogs, and then we had access to the UFC and how did we cover those events, so I was in Vegas.

And it was Kevin Lee versus Tony Ferguson, and then it was like, well we don't have anyone else here, we're not gonna fly videographers from Ireland, you go rent a camera and then go start recording the stuff.

And it performed well, and then just slowly over time.

Just with the way the industry changes, right, video sort of performs better, makes more money for people, so you sort of change your focus, and I ended up being the video guy, and originally it was just video, and then they were like, well, someone has to ask a question, so then I ask questions and it just sort of built from there, really.

So it was kind of just being in the right place, being available.

It's just also we had nothing else, you know, there's like no one else here, so yeah, it kind of just, uh, and I wasn't really a massive question asker until the pandemic, and then the pandemic happened, there was only 8 of us in the room.

So like someone's gonna ask shit, so I stepped up and that's so you were like spending a lot of time in the Abu Dhabi era.

Oh I think I've spent over, I worked it out.

I spent like 160 days of my life in Abu Dhabi so far.

Did you hate it or love it?

Um, I think at the at the time there was a gratitude to just be like working and stuff, you know, to be like just thing, but I will admit.

As everyone there would attest, around week 4, week 5, you know, seeing the same people, it's like I hate every one of you .

I hate the way you breathe, yeah, sorry, it's a little stressful, but it was OK, it was an experience, I guess.

I mean, you were right there in a global pandemic going on, UFC is the first sport back, you're like part of history, right?

I mean, did you, did you realize in the moment when all that was going on, like how special it was?

I think at the time, certainly the first trips over there.

It was sort of almost exciting, right, cos we'd all been stuck in the house, so then you like get a charter plane and even like the wackiness of like masks and tests and things, it's all new and like oh my God, like you sort of feel like you're right there.

Uh, I don't know if I felt at the time I I think it was still like how does this whole thing end?

So you're kind of, you know, the new normal was like the thing that was spoken about and stuff like that, so I don't think at the time I was like oh this is historic, but I remember being.

Just like taking it in stride, I think, I, the first one in Jacksonville was like the really wacky one, because they hadn't figured out a thing about it yet.

I was next to, I don't know if they want me to tell this, I was next to Jackarray, cos they had these like, like little pinprick of blood and you put it on like a little strip test, and I was obviously complete bullshit, as the nurse told me.

Um, and they're like, oh if it gives you two lines, you have COVID and if not you don't, and she was like, none of this makes sense, but I was next to Jackcare when he tested positive.

I was like looking at him like.

Good luck, bro, you know, so uh.

Uh, yeah, so that was really wacky cos they hadn't figured it out, but the Abu Dhabi stuff they dialed it.

What a fucking time that was, huh?

It really was, yeah, tell me about it.

So what, what's like your standout memory from Fight Island basketball?

Well, we know, we know the extracurriculars, yeah, there was a drink special on the island and I, I, I was overserved and then the drink special went away for everybody in the bubble, um.

That's the story, that one day, that whole story will come out, when certain people retire and things like that, but yeah, there was a special.

And they, they, yeah, it's a very strange place, Abu Dhabi, because it's sort of half very Middle Eastern and half Western, even more so western now, but at that time I think they were still kind of getting used to us, really.

Yeah.

And so they didn't mind if you drank, but they mind if you drank and got loud or sweary, and unfortunately those two are very big side effects of drinking for me, so it's just the whole thing.

Um, so I remember that, but I do remember, I mean, obviously Habib retired.

I remember Israel beat the shit out of Paula Costa and that, and things like that.

I do, I, I'll tell you one thing I do remember is that I remember it felt truly like we were the center of the sporting world, because there was nothing else, and that was reflected in our numbers, like you'd put up a press conference, 2 million views, you know, stuff like that, that we haven't even really come close to getting since.

And I remember feeling like, well, everyone's watching, I do remember that.

So was it just like there was only like such little people there because not everybody can make their way there, they didn't want to go through the process, why were you one of those ones that was always there?

Well, because the Maclife didn't care about my safety, they're like, get out of there, no, uh, it's because, so, for example, ESPN at that time, Disney didn't feel comfortable having people travel because they didn't, you still didn't know how the pandemic was going.

Lots of people didn't have the money necessarily to sort of go and be there for 6 weeks, or some people, uh, I felt really bad for, it was the people.

I was in America, so it was OK for me, but people like in Europe and England weren't allowed to go because they didn't have the infrastructure they're ready for them to go.

So I was quite lucky in that I was just at ground zero is probably the wrong term, but I was like ground zero, you know, right up there and I think that some people weren't comfortable, the vaccination thing came up, some people didn't want to get vaccinated.

And all that, so it was just, yeah, it was just fewer and fewer people, I think, uh, I, I think another side effect was that cause I, I was obviously I've been at Sports Illustrated.

I went through the whole thing at the pandemic.

I had actually moved out to LA and When that happened and everything shut down, but I think another side effect there media companies were laying off a lot of people and were concerned about budgets and probably just weren't, weren't willing to send people.

Yeah, and also in the early days, the first trip to Fight Island, the optics weren't like the best.

I mean, I remember Dana got a lot of the UFC, they got a lot of shit for like even you're like trying to go through the pandemic, and at the time I kind of got it because we didn't really know what it was, didn't know blah blah blah.

But at the time I remember like Disney didn't wanna be seen, like if you go there and someone dies, that's like a really bad thing, so I think there was a bit of that too.

Were you scared?

No, I was just happy to be working, to be honest.

I'll tell you what I was scared about.

Because I'm not really one for being stuck in the house, like I, you know, maybe would slip, slip out and have a couple of drinks every now and again.

I was terrified every time they tested me in case I got, I had COVID and didn't realize.

That's cos then I couldn't work.

That's so I remember you, I think we got tested the 2 days before we flew and then the day before we flew, and both of those, like I was waiting for the results, very scared.

And then when we were there, we were getting tested every 2 days and that was a little less frightening, but then.

You're always just like, as it's going into your brain, you wait, like, did you get, cause you're obviously very, you know, you get a lot of recognition, especially from the UFC.

I've seen you walk into the media room and get, and Dana White give you recognition.

Uh, it's really cool to see at what point did you get to that in your career?

Was it, was it during that time when you were going there and being one of the faces there?

Obviously all the work you've put in.

Thank you, I think um.

I think with like the UFC staff, people sort of always think you deal with like, quote, the UFC but actually you're just dealing with other human beings, and during COVID, it's like I saw those people more than any of my friends, any of my family, and you just sort of eventually.

They become the de facto colleague, you know, they're working for the promotion and there is always gonna be that sort of thing, but I think it'd be ridiculous to be around someone for 26 days in a row and not at least form some sort of like, you know, there's no one else here to drink with.

Um, so I think that's kind of silly, and I think sometimes people underestimate, like, you're dealing with human beings, and do you really think, like, do you really think it's up to.

You know, someone who's working for PR, how much fucking so and so gets paid, no, so these big like antagonistic topics that come up about the UFC I think are a bit unfairly laid on the staff, but that, and then the Dana thing was kind of, to be honest, I don't really know Dana, I always never thought Dana really knew my name, I knew he recognized who I was, but I think it was like the White House thing, obviously Doug and I were there at.

He pulled me aside and said, I, I want you at the, that was the first time I was like, oh, Dana realizes I go lots of places, so that was very nice to get that recognition, yeah, but I wouldn't say it was something I knew was there.

But you've, I mean, you've spoken to him, he's , he's an intimidating guy to speak to in general.

But I've only, would have only had like 5 conversations with him when a when a camera's not there, you know.

Even our longest one was probably last year in December.

It's not like it's I wouldn't.

I wouldn't say people, I think overestimate my shitliness with the UFC.

It's not like I text Dana and be like , what's up, right?

It's actually like reporters from 10 years ago probably have a better personal relationship with Dana than I would, but maybe that's a better thing.

I don't know, I'm glad you got that, you deserved it.

Thank you very much.

I appreciate that.

Somebody who's been around and gone to all these places and traveled all over, can you give us a little bit of like the worst and best venues or fights that you've been?

The worst place in the world is Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, uh, uh, why, sir?

I it's, listen, I'm obviously, uh, the, the shtick I do is that I drink, but it's, there's not a lot there.

I think it, let's be, let's be polis, let's be fair.

It's still a developing country in terms of Western thing.

I think it's probably Riyadh is probably where Abu Dhabi was 10 years ago, and I think it's still growing and still sort of modernizing, but in terms of aesthetics, there's a lot of ground lying on the floor, and then I think there's not really a lot to do.

They kind of have coffee and shopping malls and that's about it.

So it's just, and it's.

It's just a weird place, you know, I got used to Abu Dhabi and Dubai is like the Middle East for beginners, and then you go to Saudi and you're like oh, like this is actually what it is, um, so there's a bit of an adjustment period there.

So I never really got, never really gelled with Saudi, uh, the best venues.

Um, I think the garden's pretty special.

I feel like you go in the garden, like if it's the, if it's the right fight, like sometimes you go like, God bless Daniel Cormier and Derrick Lewis, I didn't really feel the chills that night.

But if you like, if you go there and it's the right fight, you sort of think like, OK, I mean Jones Stipe , I think that qualifies.

Yeah, sure, and I think even, I think like when Nate and Jorge fought, it was like, oh, I think that was Trump was obviously there, like they're, the garden's pretty special.

I don't know, I've always, the longer I've been doing this, the more I've sort of start favoring those kind of weird quirky fight nights, like a fight night in Seattle or San Diego seems to have like more fun fights and better reactions than the pay per views in big cities, but.

You know, who doesn't love an Austin or an Asheville, you know, like crowds, the arena fills up faster, cheaper tickets, cheaper tickets, so it's more affordable to like hardcore fans.

You obviously are a competitor as well.

Oh yeah, yeah, for sure, dude.

Uh, hey, I mean you do it, if you do it once, you're a fighter, period.

It's funny, we, I have my own podcast and we had the UFC doctor on, I believe his name's Doctor Xu, very nice man, um, yesterday and it was Ben Davis and I, and he definitely thought we fought for the UFC.

Uh, cos he kept saying through the interview, I mean you guys know, and it's like we don't know, dude, and you guys fought.

Yeah, I know, but he, the way, the way he was speaking, he's like, you know, you guys would fight on with a broken arm.

I was like, I absolutely would not do that, but thanks doctor.

Also you should be able to check that out, but yeah, it's um, yes, I'm a competitor I suppose.

Uh, so what you, one MMA or how many MMA?

One MMA amateur and one bare knuckle.

OK, and the MMA was for tough enough, right?

Yes, it was, yeah, right here in Las Vegas.

Yeah, yeah.

That was cool.

When was that?

That was 21, 2021.

OK, OK.

Did you always train, or was that something that you just said, I'm gonna do this?

No, I'd always trained, but I'm always, I still am, uh like 4 months super hardcore trained guy and then eight months off for the rest of the year kind of guy.

So, I've never been consistently training, but I've been training for years.

And then the MMA fight was with Ulta.

And I signed up to that because it was the easiest way to get a fight, basically, I wanted to have a fight by the time I was 30, pandemic, postponed it, but we'll take 31.

Um, so I signed up for Ultra, and that was like 20 weeks, 24 weeks training, cos it kept getting postponed and postponed, but yeah, I signed up to that to get the fight.

Did you enjoy it?

Yeah, of course, yeah, for sure, I, uh, I mean it was rough because it was like 5 a.m. starts and things like that and I think it did.

I don't want to over like sell my experience compared to professionals, right, but I definitely think you do a camp and you realize like, man, you don't under, it's like the tiniest little things that can just fuck your day and you don't realize, like you if you stub your toe and break your little toe, that's really shit to train with, you know, and it's like, like these tiny little things that people just sort of underestimate, can really just, I, I got.

I was in Arizona two weeks before the fight, I got bit by a spider in my sleep and my entire arm ballooned up.

Oh my God, this is the sort of shit that just happens and, and no one would ever know, and it's sort of like you just have to get through that, so.

Exactly, you don't get to talk about it, you still have to go out there and perform, but nobody in the audience knows what you went through.

Yeah, so I got bit by a spider 2 weeks before, the week before I was in Abu Dhabi, and a random guy broke my nose during sparring because he just blindly, it's just, and these are little things that you're just like, wow.

And I'm doing this at this level, and I just know it's like a year for free, I imagine there's like a million bucks on the line, there's a title on the line.

You just sort of at least empathize with the stress they must mentally feel, you know, like you get, that's why I've always thought it would be really shit.

Be in the locker room right before you walk out and be like I'm not gonna win this, like just to to realize you didn't train or you came in too late or you're a bit too heavy, it must be really like, how do you still get out there, you know.

Go out there and literally put it on the line in front of everybody.

I said that last, last week when we were with Joe, I was like, you know.

People need to take it a little easier on these fighters because they, they're still humans, and they're just going out there and doing this whole thing for , you know, entertainment, obviously because they love it, but at the end of the day, it's entertainment.

Yeah, I think, uh, certainly the longer I do this, and certainly I think as well, the longer the sport's been around, the more examples we're gonna have of the damage people have done to themselves.

And I'm not gonna, you know, you don't have to name any names, but even like very recently, someone got in trouble at an airport.

You know, you would assume there's some stuff there going on and then you think, well this guy entertained you for 20 years, and you're gonna just cuss him out if he loses, like I think you should probably.

Sympathize a bit more with people who are putting their literal health and future at risk for your benefit.

Could not have said it better myself, seriously.

Yeah, I mean, health and future, I think bare knuckle boxing, um, that's really putting some health and future at risk.

How, what you obviously fought Bain and how did that come about and what made you wanna do that.

Ah, dude, I don't really, I, I don't really know why I thought it up.

But I, I think what happened was Connor bought Bare Knuckle, or Connor became a a partner and owner of Bare Knuckle, and I just thought, wow, like if, if he's there promoting it, you could really do something big if I, if I did something.

And then I thought about like potential opponents, and Ben was, has the same sort of profile as I did, he had competed before, we'd, I felt like we had similar performances.

So he seemed like a good guy to do it with, and I felt like we could build something kind of cool.

And then I reached out to them to see if they were interested, they were like yes, and then.

Uh, I had to pay him some of my purse to get him to say yes, but we got him to say yes, really, wow, yeah, um, he just had more self-respect than I did.

Um, so we got it done and then, uh.

And that because um, because of just the, like, they don't do amateur bare knuckle fights.

But you have to have 3 amateur fights to get a pro license, they're like we can't do it in America, and then they announced this fight in Marbella, Spain in a bullfighting arena, and it was sort of like, what you, this is where you guys are gonna fight.

And that also happened to be an event that Connor was super interested in and and so it just sort of evolved into this big thing that I thought maybe best case scenario it could be.

Yeah, and then it was.

What was that like, bare knuckles?

It was cool, it was, it was, it's.

It's funny because, you know, Ben's, I don't, like Ben's not like an intimidating guy necessarily, but I, you know, in bare knuckle, I feel like one punch that lands the wrong place, you're gonna be gushing blood, so I was worried, but it, I remember I flew from Salt Lake City to Marbella, and it's quite a long travel, and I remember on like the 10 hour flight, um.

I was just thinking about all the bad things that could happen, I was, I worked myself up into like such a place, I was like, I should probably write my will.

I got my laptop out and started writing a will, and then I was like, OK, this is not the mentality, so you can really like get yourself quite scared, but then once the actual thing happened, and it was the same with the MMA fight, once you're there and it's like, you're about to walk out, you kind of just.

I don't really have any sort of nerves or emotion, I just felt like, right, well, we're here now, let's just go and get this done, win or lose, like it's time to just, you have a task, let's go see it through, so.

Um, but when I was in the ring and they were announcing my name, my legs were shaking, and I was like, they're just shooting waist high, waist high, waist high.

My legs were like super trembly, but yeah.

Yeah, I mean that's a different animal, for sure.

Yeah, I was very fortunate with how the fight went, obviously I didn't really get cut or anything like that, um, and you gotta finish, I've gotta finish.

Very nice.

They said to me we're only gonna have 3 knockdowns, and they made me knock him down 4 times, and then after the 4th time I looked at um the owner like.

Come on, get this guy out of here, he's hurt, and actually I didn't give his safety at all.

I just wanted to quit before I gassed.

So I was, I was like, come on, dude, like come on, and so, yeah, and I, sorry, go ahead.

That was, I mean that you had, uh, UFC fighter Dan Hooker in your corner, and I think talking of bad futures, and he had to tra, didn't he travel like the, it was the furthest point, the furthest city you can fly to from Auckland, New Zealand is Marbella, Spain, and I told him that.

When we, he landed in the airport, I went, you just did the furthest travel you can do on this planet, and he was the perfect guy to have around me really because.

He would have never let it get too big, you know, if I started talking about it, he'd be like shut, he would belittle me basically, um, that's what friends are exactly, he would just, she's like, ah shut up, you know, and even after I won, I was like, how was that, he went, oh, do you want a pat on the back?

I was like, a little bit, a little bit.

Uh, also, no one knows that we landed and we went for dinner with um some friends, and he went on a bender and left me, and I was obviously I, I, I wouldn't mind.

Going on the bender, but everyone around me drinking and I'm having a water, just miserable because of the weight cut, and then um we had stayed, we had an Airbnb at like 6 in the morning, I heard like bang bang, bang, like really bad banging on somewhere outside in the corridor, and eventually I opened the door and he was kicking on the neighbour's door thinking it was ours being like let me in, bro.

And then I was like, Dad, I'm over here, and he went, why are you awake, get back into bed, I was like, yeah .

But he was great to have that, he's uh.

How did you guys become friends?

Yeah.

During the pandemic, so we, he was on um the fight with Chandler, uh, which by the way, again, he'd had to train in his garage with a punching bag for that fight because of New Zealand's restrictions, and his coach was an 18 year old kid, I think, he found.

So people don't really appreciate like how, I think that's right, but people don't appreciate how limited he was in that fight, but we, we were obviously there during the bubble.

And then he was going to Vegas and was unable to get back to New Zealand and I said, do you wanna like do a podcast while you're in town?

And then I don't think it takes very long for you to smell your own kind , you know.

I think you're pretty quick.

I was like, oh, you're about it.

That makes sense.

I love that.

I also have one more fight that I actually got to see, uh, beer boxing.

That's right, at fight circus.

First of all, I was like, what the fuck are you talking about?

Yes , I did do that.

That's true.

Um, I was there with Fabiano, uh, the legendary Fabiano Ringside, that was quite a show.

Yeah, a show would be right, that was for Fight circus, and that was, so the premise is you drink a beer in one hand and you box with the other.

It, I think you're perfect.

I couldn't, you couldn't have written a sport better for her, um, but so on the, it was kind of gonna be a thing and then the day of the commission in Vegas came and sort of said no you can't do this, so it became a bit more of like a pro wrestling thing, but it was still very amusing.

Ben was there, my former foe, came in to save the day and stuff like that, so that was good, and they've hit me up about a few other things um.

They wanted me to do a nunchuck fight with Nick Diaz.

Oh my gosh.

Probably gonna say no to that, thanks though, uh, I was like, inflatable, they're like, maybe, no, that's OK.

um, but yeah, they're a very fun organization, I think they sort of, they're a bit of like levity in a very serious space, you know.

Yeah, kind of, can you guys kind of explain what Fight Circus is, cos I've actually never been to it, but I've seen some videos and stuff.

So basically it's like if you took, if, if.

If you just took like really wacky gimmick matches that you would sort of see at a professional wrestling show but made it legit, it's like that.

So you know you see these sort of um.

Like Russian shows where there's like 3 guys, 3 small guys versus 1 big guy, I would say Fight Circus probably started that stuff.

They recently, obviously with the recent uh Pereira, Cyril Gan controversy, they are now gonna do a fight where you can only hit to the back of the head, stuff like that.

It's called like Herb Dean rules, I believe, so it's like the stuff you see like the pillow fight matches.

Exactly right, they've done pillow fights slap on the butt, I got the ass slap.

I would, yeah, I would never watch that, but yeah, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, I love it.

You just mentioned Herb Dean.

Um, he's been in the news a lot lately, I think we can jump around, but what do you think about, um, what's going on with Herb Dean?

Obviously you and I saw what happened on the South Lawn, and then the following, the following week with Andre Feely, and then now the 3rd time.

I think, um, I say this with sympathy for Herb because I want to acknowledge that it's not an easy job, but I do think there's a lot of levels to it.

First of all, I think if anyone does a job for long enough, you kind of get a bit, you almost get a bit too comf comfortable and maybe a bit rusty, you know, and I think there could be an element of, you've just been doing it, you know, you maybe need a break.

I also think he's the highest profile referee, he's got it, you know, he's been around forever, so anything he does will be then amplified and more recognized, so I think he's gonna take more criticism where an unknown referee wouldn't necessarily do so.

Um, I do think there's an issue with commissions in general, not her specifically, but they kind of just relentlessly back their employee, and you would think maybe.

For judges, referees, it would be better to have like a third party company that would review the tape, give them a recommendation of what should happen, rather than, it's fine, everything's good, you know, I just don't think that's very helpful, even for Herb, because I feel like Herb is now under such scrutiny.

Fans are like when Bruce Buffer says, and the referee for this fight is Herb Dean, people are like gonna start booing soon, and I don't imagine knowing everyone's watching you makes you better at being a referee, I imagine that pressure probably makes you second guess everything, and we've seen Herb second guess stuff in the past about jumping in and things.

So I think the commission would almost do him a favor to kind of like take him away for a few weeks, let people forget, and bring him back slowly, just do him a favor, um.

As far as if he's a great referee or not, I think most referees have, uh, you only notice the bad stuff because they don't do it every time, you know, so he has like one bad fight in about 15.

Right.

It's not the worst, but I don't, wouldn't say he's the best referee at this moment, but I think there's like, you get moments of form, I suppose, and I think he's out of form at the moment.

What do you think about just like what can be done about the fouling and where do you stand on that because.

Uh, you know, from, uh, if you look at the NFL , if there's a penalty, there's a penalty regardless of intent or anything, it's, there's a pen and so I think, I think the issue that MMA has that you can't really rectify is, it's so short, and a point is so massive to the outcome, and I think most people would rather, including the referees themselves, be passive.

Members rather than active, you know, you don't wanna res, you don't want to affect the result of the fight, you want the fighters to do that.

I think also you have to understand the chaotic nature of MMA means there is gonna be stuff, if an Orthodox guy throws a kick at the same time as a southpaw guy throws a kick, one of them's getting kicked in the nuts.

That's nobody's fault, that's just human anatomy moving in the wrong way.

Right.

That said, there are certain fouls that like you intended to do that, you, you don't accidentally pull a guy's man bun, you know, you did, you did that intentionally.

If you intended to foul, that's a no-brainer point off in my opinion.

So you can maybe give an allowance and stuff cause it's just the way the world works, you can allow that.

But if it's a headbutt, a bite, or, you know, grabbing hair, you're meant to do it.

I now think we're at the stage where fans, and myself included, would probably like to see eye posts maybe added to that, because.

Um It's kind of, I, I'm starting to feel like it's becoming part of a strategy.

I think there's lots of even high profile guys who throw a punch and leave a thumb out, and you just like, you know, it, it fucks you, it fucks the fight and stuff like that, and it's not even Cyril, like I think Cyril obviously does do that, but there are other fighters that you can be very sneaky with an eye poke.

And I think it's starting to get, I, I, even if you just did 6 months, I poke automatic point, you'd probably see a lot less when you stop doing that in 6 months.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's actually true, just know they know the fight's gonna go on.

I'm gonna be fine, and my opponent's going to, if I, if I disadvantage, yeah, I mean Cyril, I'd hate to, I'm not trying to like single out Cyril as if I dislike him or anything.

Cyril fought Jon Jones, the very first stroke he threw was a, a kick.

Yeah, great start.

Why I didn't get any, I didn't get any trouble, why not, you know.

Do you think or worry about now fighters when they know Herb Dean is reffing their fight, that they maybe they feel they can take a little bit more leeway because the foul won't be called?

I don't think that's a Herb Dean specific thing.

Yeah, I think, and I'm curious, and I plan to ask.

Fighters I know have cheated.

I planned to ask them, like when you did that, did you go in knowing you were going to do that, was that sort of a panic thing?

Uh, in the moment you didn't really plan it, but I would like to know, I don't, I'm not judging you for cheating, whatever, but it's like, you poked him in the eye, did you think in the moment like, oh, I need a break, poke him in the eye, or did you go in and be like, I'll get a free one?

So when I know the answers to that, I'll be able to answer a bit more clearly, but I don't think Herb's, I think if you're gonna.

Right, like if you're gonna just put your hand out with your fingers out, it doesn't really matter who is the ref, you're gonna do it.

I'm gonna say they did plan it, yeah, they definitely, I don't know, cos I know a guy, I know a guy, a friend of mine, who's also from New Zealand, he said that he got hit with a body shot and was in a lot of pain, so he just kicked the guy.

Have you seen those Angela Hill videos where it's kind of satire where she does the how you, how to trick, she's like how to eye poke and I'm, she's funny.

I mean it's that's it, it's all, so the, the reason, the thing I've always , I've always felt eye pokes were a bit sort of just kind of, like I said, a bit sort of a part of the chaos, but actually if you think about it.

There are guys who stand with that long frame who don't eye poke, like I don't really, I'm gonna look like an idiot here, but I don't feel like Izzy Adesanya pokes people in the eye all that much, you know, and he's one of those long ranking strikers, so if he doesn't have to do it, I don't feel like Anderson Silva poked many.

People in the eye, so I don't really understand if they don't do it, why does it keep happening to certain fighters, you know.

Do you think they've changed the gloves, do you, do you like that idea?

Sounds like they're looking at it, I felt like they were trying, I, they, they were trying to do that the last time um before ironically Jon Jones said no, and uh.

I don't know why, I, it doesn't seem to me why it's hard to put a curve on a glove.

Yeah, so what is it exactly, they'll just, like, where will the, so basically, so you can't extend.

Well, so, so at the, truthfully at the moment, it's all, the UFC gloves are very stiff cos you get a new pair for each fight, they're very stiff, so they actually hold your hand like that, you couldn't actually have a worse sort of glove for it, they hold your hand open and you have, you have to exert force to close them.

There are gloves like in Pride, in Rizon, at the end Bellator had them where it's a natural curve, so you'd actually have to bend the foam to get straight.

Now listen, eye pokes can still happen, right, but if you do that, it's just a lot better than that.

Yeah, right.

Dana said he was the Trevor Whitman gloves, but then it seems like Trevor Whitman priced himself out of the market.

I've never really understood that Trevor, Trevor Whitman has, is obviously a great coach, and I've never tried the.

Gloves, but I'm, I'm told they're amazing, but uh it's because he was on Joe Rogan, I feel like those gloves have been the example everyone wants to see.

If I'm right, and I hope I am, they're Onyx gloves, the, the thing that's unique about them is the strap, they have like a double strap that's meant to give you lots of support, it's not necessarily the curve.

So the UFC don't, I don't really get why they have to pay him all the money when they could just fucking curve a glove, you know, and that's like the really the issue solved, there's no one's complaining about the strap.

So I don't really understand why the Whitman thing has, I would love to see it come to the UFC just because it would be like a funny combination to this story, but I'm kind of curious why they just haven't whacked a curve on it.

So you are going, you said the madness starts next week, you're going to California or tomorrow, tomorrow, what's, what's in California?

Connor , Connor is, uh, finishing up his camp in California.

He will come to Vegas and then obviously fight week will start, so I go there.

Tomorrow, say hello, I think hopefully get some content, stuff like that, but you just, I have learnt at this stage, even if I forgot a little bit until New York, we did a media tour and then I was reminded quite quickly, you just kind of have to go with it.

You know, there's a lot of going with the hurricane and if you can sort of just sort of, I, I, I get a kick out of watching people who are new to it, experiencing it, you know, just 1000 people following him wherever he goes.

Um, but yes, it's like I said, it's pretty crazy to have him back.

It's pretty cool.

Yeah, for sure is, um, is he, is he out there training with a specific team or does he just bring all his team?

He's got everyone, he brings them everyone.

He brings everyone over.

He's had the same team for since forever.

It's been 5 years delay.

There was obviously a lot of things that went on.

In his 5 year layoff, a lot of legal things and stuff like that, and now he seems to kind of be this changed man.

Is this, you obviously seem to know him more.

Is this real, like this changed person, he went to, uh, yeah, he went to therapy.

I mean he's been open about that.

He went to a place he found God, it seems.

I think he's always been religious, but I think the therapy he had opened him up more to that, and I think, uh, I don't want to speak for the guy, but I think when you have therapy and you make drastic life changes, you need to sort of find things to also channel that energy in and and.

Things like that, so he's he, he's always been religious, but I, when he came out of that therapy he was extra, um.

So yeah, I mean it seems to have done him good, he's recommended it.

He recommended it to Craig Jones, who was absolutely appalled that he recommended therapy.

He recommended that, he recommended that therapy to Craig, and Craig was like, what, like, like me, you, me, it's like, but yeah, he's, it's uh it's every time I've spoke to him, been around him, very earnest.

Yeah, that's awesome, it's really cool to see him, you know, make the changes because he was an incredible person in our sport still is obviously, and it's just, it's.

Awesome to see him back, cos there was a time, I think we all thought, I don't know, did you ever think he's never coming back, cos as me as a fan, I definitely did.

I just didn't know, you know, because I felt like he also gets really into interests, right, like he had, he wanted to go into politics in Ireland, and I felt like that was gonna take him away, and then, you know, he sort of decided to go against that, and he gets into these different interests, and I, I always wondered, would he come back, but as he said uh in an interview in New York, um, I think with Ariel.

He said if you love something you always come home, you know, I think that's , I think it's.

I this is a really weird thing to say, I kind of just hope he enjoys it all, you know, I hope he comes back and realizes, oh yeah, I do love this, and then it sort of stops him from just like going around doing different stuff, you know.

Yeah, how old is he now?

He's gonna be 38 come fight night.

His birthday is July 7th, so I think it's actually during fight week.

I mean 5 year layoff, he's obviously fighting now a week or a week or so away, not an easy comeback fight after a 5 year layoff, Max Holloway.

I think what I mean, obviously you have a relationship.

He is your boss, but what do you make of the layoff and contractually I say he wins how this, how do you think, how do you see this fight playing out?

I think, um.

Well, first of all, and I'm not just saying this cos he's my boss, right, I do believe there's an element of, you know, in boxing, for example, today, Tyson Fury's boxing could be a yoga instructor as far as I'm aware.

Anthony Joshua, different sort of situation cos of his thing, his incident that he had, but he's also taking a tune up.

You don't get a tune-up in the UFC, but you also don't usually get fights like a Max Holloway either, you know, Max Holloway was one fighter guy who could afford Elia and fought for the title, you know, so I think that there's some credibility and.

Should get credit for at least taking this fight, you know, it's not, after 5 years, this is not a picnic.

I also think, Connor is this funny guy where, if you said this about anyone else, oh this is the situation, they're coming back, they're fighting this guy, I think most people would be like, well then, it's gonna be hard, but Connor has always had.

And I think probably will always will have this weird touch of like destiny about him, bonbon, but that it's kind of like uh he, he has this thing, he just makes you a believer.

Makes you, I'm told I haven't seen him spar, but I've been told looks better now than he did for the Chandler fight, like he's, I think he's much more locked in.

It's different weights, and I I I think.

I, I, you know, I really, I love Max as well.

Max is a great guy.

I think if you were gonna fight Max as Connor, this might be the time, you know, the last 3 fights he's been in, he's been dropped.

Higher weight class, Connor would be the bigger man.

You know, it's just, and also as well, like, I would have, you know, traded my mum's life on the fact Idia was gonna beat Justin, and that did not happen, you know what I mean, so this is a wacky sport for the record.

Do you think that he comes back in full form of, you know, who he wants to know, the boogeyman?

Uh, I think Elia's, this is a weird, a bit of a weird thing to say, I think Elia's aura took less of a hit than like Hamzat's did against Sean, you know, when you see, when you see Hamzat tweeting, Sean, stop running, it's like.

He beat you, you know, that you don't feel it, you mean, yeah, post-fight after the loss, I feel like Sean's Hans that's loss did worse to him than Edie's loss to Justin, you know, I think Edie will come back and I.

I, I really feel like Elia fought pretty not great in that fight, you know, he really, I, I felt like the moment, and the prediction and all that stuff kind of got to him in the same way, ironically, I think it did for Connor against Nate the first time, when Connor just came out and was like, I'm fucking smoking this dude, and then 4 minutes in you're like, why is he still here?

I think Elia had the exact same thing.

So it's just about how he reacts to that, but he's always struck me as a very, very smart guy.

I think anyone who speaks multiple languages and in their second or third language speaks as philosophically as he does, shows an incredible intelligence.

Francis Nganno are the same thing, they speak better than any of us do, you know, like I do.

So I think, I, I imagine he will have his T's and I's crossed and dotted.

Absolutely.

Um, um, rolling back to Connor, how, how do you kind of see the avenues that he's gonna take in this fight?

You think he's just gonna stand and box with him?

Obviously Max's one of the best boxers in the game.

You think he's gonna try to wrestle.

I think a lot of that, not to give anything away, of course, under pain of death, I think, um.

I think for me the thing for Connor, like the X factor in the fight will be, will be controlling the moment.

Obviously he has been in literally the biggest moments in this sport , but Max has been doing them a lot more frequently recently.

Connor's been away for a lot.

Obviously had the injury, it's been a long journey back.

So as long as Connor's able to control, I, I, I think Connor's biggest.

Risk here is sort of having the moment be like oh the adrenaline and just having that dump or something like that, you know, just really getting in there and sort of like, fuck, it's been a while, you know, but he's always been very sort of cerebral with his mindset, obviously.

So I think as long as he controls that, you might see a very mixed bag of what he does, you know.

Awesome.

I'm so excited, it's gonna be incredible.

Separate from his performance in the octagon, do you think we'll see Conor McGregor's performance during fight week of, what do you expect of about can't hate Max.

Bro, no one hates Max, so I think, I think, I think there will be a little bit of ribbing, but I don't think it'll be like that 3rd Dustin fight was obviously pretty not nice .

I don't think it'll be as nice as the 2nd Dustin fight, but I think it'll be healthy competition.

But I, I think, you know, I think there's uh Max has been out of all the people that's been linked to fight Connor over the years, Max has never said a bad word about him.

Like Max really has always shown Connor respect, has always had a fondness for Connor, and because of that, I think Connor feels the same way, like I said, you know, you can't hate Max Holloway.

um, so I don't imagine it'll get ugly, but I imagine there'll be.

Yeah, that's a show.

There'll be a little bit of Mac life there, yeah, yeah, yeah, it'll be a bit of a show.

Uh, and then we got the debut of Gable Stevenson.

Yeah, I think, I mean, flying under the radar somewhat, I feel, well, so I think I, and I, we didn't talk about this, but it kind of just came to me like the narrative with obviously Gable Stevenson.

We were wondering when he was getting, get into the UFC.

Now it's happening during International Fight Week, and it was kind of he's gonna come in and save the heavyweight division, right?

But I I think, and we can talk about the what Josh Hoki kind of came on the scene, and I do you feel that maybe he's stealing, stolen some of the buzz around Gable because now there's some buzz in the heavyweight, honestly, I, you know, I didn't sort of, I think it speaks to that.

I haven't really thought about Gable, to be honest.

I think I haven't either.

I brought it up, if you go on the UFC.

Page when you're looking at the fight, he's he, he don't even have a picture, it's black, it's like a black which is crazy, but I think he'll get one fight week, he'll get, but I think um I think also it's matchup, right, he's, he's not fighting someone that people are super excited to see him fight.

I, I heard way back that they wanted his debut to be against Derek, which would have been like a real statement, like wow, you're gonna come in and fight someone like Derek, and frankly.

You know, could have done well against Eric, so I think that would have really like had people going, now it's kind of like oh it's, it's a bit like when Bo Nickel came in, it's like they're just feeding him some guy, um, I think what is interesting about the Josh Hockett thing is, as you said, that he sees her as taking some of the thunder, but also respectfully, if you watch Gable's interviews, he's very, very, very media trained.

He's very, very sort of, doesn't really want to commit to any sort of answer.

I believe if he does that on Fight Week, it'll only.

Make Josh Hokit look more like the cool and like more interesting one, and maybe we'll actually di diminish Gable's star power more, but I'm not sure.

And then there's, you know, the Jon Jones thing is around as well, like it's all, it's, I, I, I always think back to when Floyd Mayweather and Tank Davis were a pairing.

And it was kind of like tank couldn't really shine cos Floyd was there, you know, and it's I didn't think of that.

It was more meant to be like, oh, Floyd's gonna boost him up, but Floyd never was gonna let anyone get boosted up, and I wonder if John and Gable might be the same thing.

So is John in his corner then I assume, right?

Is that weird?

Because of like the drama he's having with the John will be in his corner fight night, yeah, yeah, yeah, John, but like I said, I think John's gonna be pretty attached to Gable.

I wonder which one's gonna be benefiting, you know, who's that makes sense.

That's kind of messed up.

It's fucked up.

We'll see.

I mean he's, he's.

It's, it's just weird cos John's, John clearly isn't done either.

You know, if John got offered the right fight for the right money, he's clearly fighting, so how can you really commit to being this guy's, yeah, can I push back there?

I mean, he was offered $30 million the right guy, not the right guy.

You don't think if they offered him Pereira, he would have fucking be like, I know, but right, I know, but he's not gonna get paid $30 million to fight a can.

Well, allegedly he's gonna be boxing Ui or some I saw yesterday, yeah, I think, uh.

I don't, I, I believe there's a world we'll see him again.

Yeah, I, I, cos John's a very tactician.

See how that title picture works itself out, and then you never know, Cyril's champion again, hello, who's this, you know what I mean, it could easily.

Do you have a prediction for Gable and like maybe even like the late trajectory of his career if he gets this?

I think what they'll do, I think he'll win.

uh I imagine he'll get a knockout cos he's very, very, very aggressive and athletic, uh.

I think they'll do what they did with Bo where they'll have him fight kind of like 3 nobodies and then take a big step up.

That's usually the way they did.

The same thing with O'Malley, they had him like fight like nobody, nobody, nobody, had a big fight.

Like Peter Yad out of nowhere, you know, so I think that's probably what will happen, his issue will be the same as Josh Hockett's, where it's like there's no one in the division to fight, you know, so that you win two fights, suddenly you're in the top six, and there's no one else, you can only fight good guys, uh, I think they'll hold that fight, Gabriel and Hockett, off forever, cause that's , that's, that's like a big fight, you know, the right people win, so.

What are your thoughts on Josh, Josh Oa because obviously he performs in the cage, he's a freak athlete.

We were at the White House and I, I mean, I'll just be frank, I was disgusted by what happened in the cage.

I think even Dana was disgusted by it.

What, what, what do you see for his future and how are they just gonna let him conti status 100%.

I gotta let him continue.

Yeah, I mean, I, what's it gonna take, because he's, he's gone after Yi in the hotel, sorry, he's gone after Yuri in the hotel, he's gone.

Listen man, it's, it's this sport, you get rewarded for that.

No, I know, that's you get rewarded for it.

Um, my own perspective on him is I think we should have, I think people should have learnt their lesson from Colby, and I'm not even gonna add my moral take on it, I'm just gonna speak objectively.

You can't keep doing the thing where it's like oh it's not really him, it's character.

It's like well, if you go look at his Twitter, I think today or yesterday he spoke about how uh the Obamas were communists and stuff like that, it's like this isn't all character, so he kind of believes what he's saying.

But then you have to take him at his word, yeah, I don't really buy into the people.

We're not a TV show, you know, it's just, it's not like that.

I don't think you could be a, I think it's maybe you turned up to 11 or at some point you morph into a character , but I don't really give people grace for saying fucked up shit and then saying I didn't mean that, I was playing a role.

I don't really think that's stand on business, right?

Yeah, but to be, to his credit, he's clearly not apologizing, you know, so he's, he's gonna stand on business.

Personally, the whole thing, I don't really.

I feel, and it's different for everybody, I know one of our colleagues on Media Row was very upset, but I, I feel like if it's said by.

I, I don't think he's an idiot, but let's say, like, it's said by an idiot, it's very easy to disregard, do you know what I mean, like I, I don't take that and run with it because it's like, well, I don't really respect that opinion anyway.

I just felt it was such a shame for the venue.

I just thought, I thought, cos I went in thinking like this is gonna be a, a Trump fest, I think it's gonna be, and it wasn't at all, and it wasn't at all, I thought they did.

They balanced it very, very well, I thought it really was just about America and as apolitical as you could make it.

And then he said that, it's like, ah, you just fucked it, well done, you know, it's just like what, yeah, it's just, just all the mainstream we're gonna talk about, and again, it's for, I, I would, I would like to ask, ask him, and I plan on doing so, what is the goal, like, do you do this because you think this gets you a title quicker, do you do this because you think you're gonna get right wing sponsors more, do you do this because it's just about getting attention, you wanna get more attention which will get you the rest of the things.

What is the goal, because.

I understand you don't care , but isn't it nicer to be nice?

Isn't it nice, is it, is to be, yeah, is it, but is it, is it just like you realize that's not the way to go, so you're gonna do this because it's gets you further, like what is the motivation behind saying fucked up shit?

Do you think it's funny , I'd be curious, I'm really curious, does he think like he did the kill Tony stand up in it ?

I'd be curious if he's being intentionally unfunny or if he thinks that's very funny.

I, I, I thought.

See, I think a lot of his shtick is funny, and I think it's a lot of it is good for the sport, like the Kill Tony.

I know, I know a lot of the old school media members are rolling their eyes, but like people were talking about it, you discuss it, it's something to discuss, and then a year where we've said the sport's dead as fuck, you know, it's nice to be able to watch a press conference and come away saying and talking and having talking points, so.

Sure, but I'm just curious, he laughs at himself when he does stuff like, am I right, Miami?

He starts laughing.

But that's, but I find that funny, and the fact that he knows that's funny is good.

But then when he does the jokes about like, you know, a hefty mamacita or whatever the fuck he's saying it's like, does he, does he think this is actually like killing, or does he know that it's like really crazy?

He's like, yeah, he, he's like riding it before he goes out this one's gotta get him, you know, I just don't know if he knows it's not funny, but maybe it is to people, I don't know.

Um, what about the weigh-in thing with the, he like threw up, it was like I did not enjoy it, that was baby food.

I believe it's baby food.

Yeah, well, what was funny about that was the commission guy was really pissed cos he's like, well I'm meant to take you at your word.

I'm meant to believe like the thing, you're, you're on this scale shaking, you're throwing up, I'm meant to believe you.

I should pull you from the fight.

And then I think he had to be kind of calmed down and talked down, but it's like that would have been very funny to me if he got pulled, if he got fucked around and found out real quick, but that's.

That's, I mean, I, I didn't, I didn't get that bit, to be honest, when I was watching, I was like what the, but yeah, what was he saying was wrong?

He was saying he'd been on, he said he'd said he'd been on a bender, I was, I've been on a bender, I'm not throwing up, I'm here, I'm fine.

Yeah.

Oh my gosh, that's funny, I thought about you when you said that.

Yes, they said, when I was a bit younger, there's a few pay per views I had to run to the bathroom after.

Oh my goodness.

Quick little segue about the White House, and I think the oddest moment of the night was Tyson Fury's grand, grand entrance.

What did it, I mean, you and I looked at each other like, well, it just felt like he was coming out to announce he was with Zooer Boxing or he was fighting Joshua, right?

It just, and they, they played his, he like, he walked out to those songs in Wembley.

Uh, Against Gillian White, so they played his songs, they gave him the entrance.

I took it as like, oh, he got his visa, I wonder who here gave him that, but I was, it felt like the announcement was there, and then I, if you recall, I borrowed your headphones to listen to, to listen to the broadcast, and it was just really weird, the giant accent.

Like you have a big announcement, no, it's just like you got that for nothing.

It was so random, like what is bro doing here?

Yeah, I'm curious if maybe, I don't know, maybe there's like a letter received right before or something like that, it just felt, but Tyson's also a slippery character, Tyson also knows.

Like Tyson plays games too, you know, so I want, I, it just felt really fucking weird and then Dana didn't want to expand at the press conference, right, very, very strange.

You think it's Zufa?

I don't, I think listen, Zufa and Turkey are one and the same.

Turkey owns a huge port part uh part of Zuer boxing.

So I don't think it's Zuer boxing, but it's definitely Turkey.

I and I think if you saw the next day Tyson announced Turkey's my promoter, again I suspect there were conversations had before those posts, um, so I think it's Turkey, like I, but.

I was very curious, I saw Eddie Hearn say today that he's going for a peace summit talks with Nick Khan, not with Dana, Nick Khan in Turkey not with Dana.

And then, you know, Dana said to me the other day, oh I've never heard about it, and then you just sort of wonder like, how is this thing going?

Who's friends here, cos Nick Khan and Turkey have the WWE relationship.

I, I didn't necessarily believe Dana when he said that he didn't know about it.

No, I'm sure he knew about it, but it's curious to me he's not attending.

Yeah, right, that feels like.

I just want, I just, I just think Turkey's also a slippery character.

Fun fact, I noticed, by the way, as soon as Turkey and Zuer boxing became a thing, don't really hear His Excellency said much anymore from anybody, you know, Eddie and Frank Morris calling him His Excellency, don't really hear it, it's just Turkey now.

That's interesting.

Once he's not paying you money, like fuck off.

That ties into the Eddie Hearn, Dana White beef in general, supposedly they're gonna box.

I talked to Eddie Hearn last week and he said, you know.

Dana called me out and now he's backtracking.

I've been off.

I've, I got us $20 million.

What do you make of all that more than anything.

I mean, it would be unbelievable content, unbelievable .

I I couldn't believe the way Dana was like, yeah, up.

I was like, no disrespect to you, no disrespect to you.

I don't know if you've boxed in a while, you know, uh, so yeah, I was curious about Dana's confidence.

I now listen, I asked Nikisa.

Who obviously has worked with both of them, and he was like, Dane Hall, what do you think the future, when we're talking about Zufa boxing two years from now, what, what do you see the landscape of boxing in general Turkey say he had left 2 years, was it?

Um, yeah, sad news.

That to be honest, that's probably the biggest factor, right?

Like, cos I'm sure I've known about his health for a long time, but he was the first, that's the first time I've heard a date, you know, uh put on it.

Uh, so I feel like it sort of depends on if his attitude is, well, I may as well just pump everything I have into this because there's no after it, is it a case of I need to stop because I need this money to go to family or whatever, so, it's kind of about his motivations and stuff like that.

Part of me feels for Turkey.

I had always heard the rumor that Turkey was sick.

I'm just thinking if I'm allowed to say this, I think I can.

I've always heard the rumors that Turkey was sick and his motivation for getting into boxing.

Was he was a massive fan that wanted to see these things before he died basically, and that was always the rumor I was told.

I was told that when N Ghani fought Fury, that's how long ago I heard that.

That he was doing these fights because that he didn't want to die without seeing them.

And I always felt that Fury, Joshua was kind of his golden goo, like that was the one, that was the white whale that he always wanted, and I wonder if maybe after that he feels like my work here is done, you know, I saw Canelo's fight got postponed.

That's never a good look if you don't get a a a postponed date, if it's just like oh it's postponed for now, it's never really a good thing.

I just wonder if maybe the Saudi authority is saying, come on, there's a lot of fucking money going out, not much money coming in.

But in terms of super boxing, I think they'll probably really, really overspend for the foreseeable, and then it's just about can they, it's, can they beat the culture of boxing, because boxers are, this is not a negative, a lot more entitled when it comes to money than MMA fighters.

Like MMA fighters usually break, like the UFC will offer them something, the UFC, the fighter will try and wait, and eventually the UFC can just like outwait them.

So they usually take it.

Boxers seem much more inclined to be like, I just won't fight for two years.

You know, they seem much more willing to do that.

So when they get the Shakurs and people like that under contract, but eventually maybe try and say like you're not worth $30 million for fighting a scrub, how does that navigate, you know?

To be honest, everything's this, this week, next week, everything's on hiatus until we're through with this because.

Like this is, we, we are back to the days of, hey, be at the apex at 11 p.m. and then you're there at 3 p.m. 3 a.m. when he comes in and we're just back at that time.

So it's, I look healthy now.

Yeah.

Is it, are you excited though, kind of to like be back in the, be back in this fight week with him?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean it's, it's similarly like what I said about like it's kind of a task, right, I don't really, I just want to get it done, you know, and I I'm like one of those sort of people that are like OK, we're gonna get it done and then you sort of think about it after.

But I am going to try and appreciate the fact that like.

He, we could never have seen him again, and so it's very cool just to have him at like a media day, have him at a press conference, probably like savor the moment because it's like wow dude, like fucking who would have thought, you know.

Right, you think this is a chance this is just the one and done, you don't think he comes back for I yet?

I think he, oh I, I don't know, but I think he'll fight again.

I think he'll fight again, win or lose.

Yeah bro.

I think dude, it's, it's so hard.

It's so hard to get out of that UFC contract.

And it's even harder when you're someone like him, you know.

And he has 3 left, and he's got this one and 1 more, and that one's already got a date in April.

Oh, so.

What like all he has to do is get through 2 and then the world of Netflix, and that is right there for you.

Amazing, you know, I guess we're not wrapping up because now I'm thinking of it more if you don't mind, um, so he has two fights, say he goes out, knocks Mac Max out, who knows who is next.

opponent is, but because he's Connor, he's realistically one fight away from that title.

Oh, I would assume that's, but then it, that's where it gets complicated because there's a championship clause where if you're the champion you can't leave, so then what, how do you fight, if he fights for the champion, then what his deal just gets extended, that might not be what he wants.

I suspect if he beats Max.

There will be hefty negotiations, you know, because I, I, I, I bet they would love him to go back down to lightweight, that's gonna cost them.

And then listen, if he waits, if he just gets through the next one.

You know, he's still one of the most relevant people in sports, really, where you see the numbers climbing up as we get to fight week, ESPN, everyone's covering it, uh, the just the bids will be crazy, and I'm of the opinion uh that Connor, if you look at what Floyd Mayweather was paid for pay per view buy rates during his run at the, the 2010s or whatever, 2000, 2010s, Connor got those same buy rates for fucking so much less money.

So Connor is both the most highest paid and I think very much one of the most underpaid athletes, like, you know, if you're he got 1.7 million paid view buys like three times, and you know Floyd would get 100 million plus for that, and Connor never got that for the UFC, so I think.

Just in case, you said it recently, I think a lot of these guys as they come to the end of their career and it's the final contract, they're kind of gonna want back pay, which is what Jon Jones wanted, admittedly he never took it, but a lot of these guys are gonna want back pay, like, hey, I'm now in a place where you need to pay me for all that stuff too.

Right, damn.

I have one more question.

Somebody who is, you know, where you're at, at your level, um, I feel like we have a lot of people that are in the MMA media or want to break through MMA media.

Even myself, I look up to you in a sense.

What, what would you rec, what would you say, you know, to people that kind of got you to where you are at right now?

You know, you can't, uh, there's only so much you can control, and it's actually an increasingly changing landscape.

I don't know that if I started now I'd be able to be where I was, you know what I mean, it's very change, it's that the UFC are looking for different things, it's, it's completely changed, so I'll say this with the caveat that I don't know if it matters in today's world, but there's only certain things you can really control, for example.

When I started, I felt like, well I can't be as good a writer as Chuck Mindenhall and I can't be as good uh an interviewer as Ariel Hawani, the only thing I can control is the amount of hours I'm willing to put in.

So that's what I said when I would set alarms and stuff like that to be able to be awake for European news and things like that, I was like well I'm doing that and other people aren't, so that's gonna give me percentage gain on what they're, they're willing to do.

I'm willing to fly to Qatar, I'm willing to do that because it's the only thing I can really control and sort of put yourself out there.

So I think.

But you also have to work smart as well, you know, there's there's a learning period there, but I think if you could, the only thing you can control is your effort, so I'd just how bad you want it.

And then secondly I think as well, you're gonna fuck up, you're gonna make mistakes.

I think I've decided it's better to overthink things before.

Rather than after, like if you overthink a question like how's that gonna affect this relationship, how's that gonna affect that, that's alright, but if you do something and then beat yourself up about it for a week, that's not helpful, just get over it, you know, that's really good advice, yeah, yeah, for sure, the 45 minute thing is very admirable, it is very admirable.

Yeah, I just, because at the time I just remember thinking like the Mac Life is so.

Small and new and I was just like man they could like this could be huge and I just thought of it as like an investment of time that would pay off in the future, you know.

But it's that exactly like I think people kind of see what we do, even me like just starting like they think it's so glamorous and oh you're so lucky, but it takes that kind of work to get I think as well like you know sometimes people ask you like how can you get a job and stuff, it's like man I don't think you like you know you really like know.

There's a lot of, you know, there's a lot of sitting around and with laptops in front of you in fucking restaurants.

I was just gonna say it's like the classic scene after a press conference where I'll go at the bar and we're like, and like sometimes you have to pull yourself away and be like, you know what, this can wait, I'm gonna have a beer and then I'll and then I'll go back to it.

It's really hard to do and I still struggle with that, but I struggle with it all the time, but then also listen.

Like I said, construction worker, the best day I had on my building site is still worse, the worst day I've had it, not the worst day.

Brooklyn was pretty bad for the Mac, but other than that, we've been good.

And super grateful to have you come on in the corner with us.

Well, there you guys have it.

What did I say?

There is not a better person we could have brought in for the week before IFW International Fight Week.

The man that's worked closely with Conor McGregor works with the Mac Life production, one of the most iconic traveling members in the MMA media world, and he's also competed himself.

So it's cool to talk to somebody who understands both sides.

And you know, just to get a little bit input of, you know, how to kind of be maybe where he's at, you know, at the end he was able to run run run through that about what it really takes, and I think that sometimes people think that this all looks so glamorous and it's just different, so I'm glad that we got to have him on.

He was great.

You know, Oscar's been doing it long.

I've been doing it far less longer than he has, and he's one of the guys that when I first went in that media room, I was like, Oh, that's Oscar Willis, and I've tried to mimic.

I'll never be able to be Oscar, but I've tried to mimic what he does, and it's, uh, it's been fairly successful.

Well, thank you guys so much for tuning in.

You know what it is, real fighters, real stories, real talk.

We'll see you next round.

See you next week.