Jokic vs. Wemby Was a Preview of Things to Come

All right, uh, last thing for you.

I want to talk about the game you mentioned there, the one I was at on Saturday, the Nuggets and the Spurs, the battle at the top of the Western Conference standings, the battle between two of the best players right now in the NBA and it delivered.

Uh, Nikola Jokic, 40 points, I think it was 13 assists, 8 rebounds.

Victor Wimbayama, 34 points, 18 rebounds, 7 assists, 5 blocks in this game.

You had Nikole Jokic hitting.

The greatest Sombor shuffle you have ever seen.

Up until that point, I thought the Anthony Davis one where he hit a 3 over Davis.

You know, Davis draped all over him when he switched pivot feet and threw up the 3.

that was the best shot that Jokic had made.

No, no, no.

That takes the cake.

That shot that Nikola Jokic made over Victor Wambayama with the 8-foot wingspan, with the Nuggets clinging to a 2-point lead with 1 minute left in overtime, that was the best shot I've seen Nikola Jokic, uh, make up until this point.

The question is, Did this move the needle for you, uh, when it comes to the MVP race?

Like Tim Bon Temps just had his straw poll come out, 88 first-place votes for Shay Gildes Alexander.

I'd have to say I was one of them that voted for Shay.

Uh, but now you have two of the other top four guys putting on a show on Saturday against each other.

Did that move the needle for you one way or the other?

I don't know, only because I didn't learn in this game that Victor Webayama or Nikola Jokic was good.

So no, it did not move the needle.

I mean, where it moves the needle in an MVP race is if one guy is playing against the guy who is the presumptive favorite and he takes him to school.

That's where it moves the needle in the MVP race, that the other two guys who are not the presumptive favorite have a great battle against each other.

That's why everyone was watching the Luca game on Thursday, right, exactly, to see.

And by the way, that is why, I mean, I said this on, on Fox, on TV on Friday morning like.

Yes, Luca got hurt in that game, but it was very obvious way before he got hurt that the Thunder were on a mission to say, hey, this is all cute, what's been going on, but let's not mix words here.

Shay is the MVP.

We are a much better team.

We are in a different class than the Lakers.

And I think they showed that, you know , even before the injury.

So.

You know, didn't move the needle for me?

No.

Did it just make me wish?

Again, it just came out of what I, you know, you and I sat down before we started taping and in addition to talking about the gullibility of your young child, I was saying, man, it just, there are some years I wish we could have a round robin.

of the top teams in one conference and say great, these three teams are gonna battle it out in a round robin to see who gets to the finals.

And that's, I mean, the amount, the, the great basketball that would produce and the worthiness of whoever would get to the finals would be so cool.

And I wasn't saying what I was saying earlier about the Thunder saying they're not.

Worthy to get to the finals.

I'm just saying I wish that the competition they faced in the Western Conference wasn't going to be these two teams having beaten up on each other at altitude because I would love to see a conference finals where one of these teams at full strength would be able to go up against the Thunder.

And I just, all that game showed me was like, man, can we just call it the regular structure, the regular bracket structure for this season and say these three teams are going to do a round robin to see who comes out of the West in the conference Finals and We'll go from there.

It was awesome to watch live because both these guys just showed what they got.

Like Jokic and his shotmaking, Wembayama and his defense, Wembayama looking like a 7-4 Magic Johnson at times, driving the paint, kicking out, like doing things that you've just never seen before.

I, I don't think it moved the needle for me either because as great as those two played.

I think I kind of went in looking for like one to separate from the other, and I'll say I, I was kind of looking for like Wembayama to have this kind of offensive game and then totally shut Nikola Jokic down like that probably would have moved the needle a little bit, uh, for me.

Do you know who you're voting for behind Shay?

No, I mean, I, I voted for Wemby in the Bon Temp straw poll.

I think there is still some variability there, uh.

I mean, I guess in that sense, like how he played, and look, Jokic didn't really match up with him that much.

It was Aaron Gordon, who was phenomenal, uh, for stretches, uh, against him.

Uh, I, I guess.

Maybe that solidified Wambayama at #2 for me because of how well he played on both ends of the floor.

Um, But it didn't It didn't give him a better chance on my ballot to jump up to number one, I guess how I'd frame it.

I think for some people who kind of, you know, the way these conversations work, which is hilarious, by the way, because people then vote exactly how you'd expect them to despite all this back and forth and quote in the conversation.

Um, I think for some people it was like, oh yeah, Nikola Lukic is still around, guys, and I think there have been so much Wendy Shea Wendy Shea talk over the last month or so.

And then Luca's kind of in that conversation now too that people are kind of in some, not on your ballot where you had Luca at 4th or 5th, but there are some people with Luca, I mean, who still might finish there.

I think he finished.

Did he finish 4th on Bon Temp's poll?

I think he did, yeah, Luca, yeah, no, no , but I'm just saying that I think that.

The conversation nationally over the past 6 to 8 weeks has been Shay Wemby, Lucas, Shay Wemby Luca, Luca, Wemby Shay, you know, whatever it is, and I think that game maybe moved the needle for even just fans maybe to be like, oh , actually Nik Nikola Hokic still has an argument for being the best basketball player in the world even if he's not the MVP Saturday afternoon.

Like, like I, I get why you had to do it because it's the, the Final Four and you want to get games out of the way early, but that was the kind of game I would have spotlighted that Sunday night basketball team.

Thursday night basketball ESPN Wednesday or Friday.

Saturday afternoon was, I mean, I love it.

I'll watch Saturday afternoon games.

That just goes into the way the, the TV schedule works is that each partner network gets to pick certain games.

They get first pick, and then the other team gets for other team.

The other network gets first pick, and then they get their pick.

And so and Amazon is big internationally, so I'm sure that game played well overseas.

100%.

I do want to say that that shot that you're talking about made me look up what Wendy's reach is.

Because we know how tall he is, we know what his wingspan is.

Apparently his reach, meaning when his hand is straight up over his head, is around 10 ft.

So to have to take 8 ft reach, yes, oh, I guess, yeah, 8, I think he's an 8 ft wingspan.

But with the standing, his arm is higher than many people's arms, so, um, the shoulder starts higher than many other people.

Look, I didn't go out and measure him.

I'm just telling you that the accepted NBA measurement of his reach up above his head is around 10 ft.

I'm sure at the combine they measure these things.

I did not take a 10 tape measure.

To to Wemiyama, but this is what the accepted NBA measurement is, is about 10 ft.

And so imagine taking a shot if you are Jokic, where there is a 10 ft wall that close to your face.

It's not just that it's a 10 ft reach and you've got to get over the 10 ft.

It's where that 10 ft barrier is.

So to have a 10-foot wall that close to you and to be able to take and make that shot is so, I mean, it's just spectacular and to do it with a double team coming to shed the double team by ball faking and then doing your switch pivot foots fade away like the degree of difficulty of that shot, best shot in the NBA this season, no.

Has to be.

I'm trying , I mean, I'm sure somebody will be listening to this and saying, oh, look at this shot that they made in Cleveland during one of the games.

But this was given the circumstance, given the opponent, given the stakes, given the difficulty, yes, all that.

So, so look, Luca took that shot a few weeks ago, right, where it was like, oh my God, he takes, I forget what it was, who was it against Miami.

That he took the shot where it was just sort of that last minute, the last second, the 60 point game was it that the, was that the game where he took a shot at the end.

There was a recent shot from Luca that it was like time, place, difficulty, what it did with the game, took this great shot, bam, it reinforced that Luca is such an outrageous offensive talent that if the game is even within 10 points in the final 2 minutes.

Luca can still turn the game around.

That's what that reinforced in people's minds.

This was an individual shot with a high, way higher degree of difficulty of that particular shot.

Luca's was a lot more to me about, hey, that tells you how much he can influence the game, when and how versus this one, which is technically is a basketball shot.

This was just, it's the hardest shot I've seen in the NBA to make.

And the fact that he did it was incredible, and Victor's face when, when Jokic made that shot was also, wait, what just happened, which was great too.

I love talking to both those guys after the game because they both seem to appreciate the moment and how much fun it was to be in that type of matchup.

Like Webayama was like, man, I can't wait to do this again.

Now they play again last game of the season.

I don't think you'll, I would guess you're probably not gonna see.

The intensity, the intensity, and maybe not even them at all at that point.

Like I don't know what the, the numbers will be on making a 65 game threshold, but like you're not going to, if, if you can project to play a team in maybe the second round or whatever it may be, you're not gonna show them everything in that type of game.

So here's my question for you, just the last, before we move, we move into the playoffs and, and playoff seeding and all of that.

The conventional wisdom in the NBA is you can't play for seeding the last week of the season because you quote, upset the basketball gods, I believe is one of the primary sentences that's used.

And hey, you don't really know what's gonna happen below you and so therefore, you could be trying to get this, but then in the end, you get what you thought you were trying to avoid, X, Y, Z.

Um, I don't know, man.

We are seeing teams tank away not just one but 2 or 3 seasons.

Which is costing them millions and millions of dollars in attendance and TV and, and local TV sort of whatever and all the stuff and the wrath of the NBA and fines and all of that just to get a shot at being in a lottery, a lottery where you might get a pick that might let you draft a player that might turn into a great NBA player.

If you can manipulate something in the last week that gets you, I don't know, an extra 2 rounds of the playoffs, you might not get.

I don't see why you wouldn't do that.

I mean, if, if it's OK to do the first, why isn't it OK to do the second, and the basketball gods don't quite measure up to me as an answer for not doing that superstition.

I don't know.

Do you see anybody who can or should manipulate their last week here?

I mean, not in a way where you'd kick a game, but like.

We talked about Oklahoma City playing the Lakers.

You want to pound them and make sure you win that game, but that's considered OK because you're trying to win, even though it's also bracket, where are we looking though?

Like, are we thinking like, I don't know.

I'm just, it just like Houston wants to stay in that 5 spot or jump to 4 because everybody wants to play the Lakers now because they don't have their guys, um.

And when you get down to 789, 10, then it's just a crapshoot because You know, but I think any of the teams at the top half think they can beat any of the teams at the bottom half.

I think it will, there will be games and matchups and series where it will be tougher than others, but I don't think this is a year.

I mean, do you, do you think there's a team in the West that's in the bottom half of the draw that's gonna get to the conference finals?

So I don't , I don't think that that's, I think the East is maybe a little bit more interesting.

I'm looking at the standings right now.

I think the Celtics in the 2nd round would probably rather play the Cavs than the Knicks, um, and they've got the Knicks coming up on Thursday.

I'm gonna be at that game in New York.

Uh, maybe you go extra hard in that game, try to knock the Knicks down a peg.

They're only a game up right now.

Uh, but again, that's considered quote OK to people because you're trying to, I don't, I don't see any scenario.

I'm asking whether you think in general, in general, maybe I'm not playing my guys in this game because I'd like to manipulate the bracket, or yeah, if there, if there was a situation, there's a bracket manipulation opportunity in the East or West this year that you think is worth doing.

I don't think there's one in either conference is worth doing, um.

And I don't know everybody's schedule off the top of my head, but I'm looking at the 5 and 6.

Atlanta sitting there, pretty entrenched at 5, 76ers neck and neck with the Raptors.

That's just too hard, too tough to tell at that point.

I don't know.

I mean, I mean, I can see the, the , the point to it, um, the merit in doing it in certain situations, but it does tend to backfire because you might wind up trying to manipulate things one way and all of a sudden it goes the other and you're stuck playing the team you didn't want to play anyway.

I just think in a reality where, as I like to say, it's the bracket, man.

Like the bracket determines so much of whether you advance to the next round, how much playoff money you're making as a franchise, how your fans feel about you, whether you feel you have to fire the coach, whether you feel pressure to go out and get a free agent or make a bad trade.

Like a lot of it depends on does your team make it out of the first round or not, right?

I, I.

It's the bracket, man.

It depends on who you play.

It depends on, do you make it out of the 2nd round?

It depends on who you play.

If you beat a team in the 1st, if you're a team that has, say, I don't know, championship expectations, if you're the Knicks' ownership, um, right, um , and you don't make it out of the 2nd round.

What does that say?

What do you think?

What do you think some hard conversations in that Knicks front office about where they're gonna go in the future, OK, but it's the bracket, man, because they could sail through the first two rounds.

Well, in the East, is it the bracket like now we're just kind of nitpicking a little bit with either conference, but in the East, like you should be able to win all these games.

Like you just beat Boston in the 2nd round last year with Jayson Tatum.

The Pistons , I don't know what they're gonna look like come postseason.

They've been great, but if Kate Cunningham's not available.

What's the situation there?

Everybody else in the east, you shouldn't be afraid of it all.

The only team that's for sure people want to play in the first round is the Lakers now for sure.

That is the one team everybody is lining up from Houston bracket manipulate for.

And by the way, the solution to it's the bracket, man, is just be the number one seed, and that's where Oklahoma City has its ultimate trump card advantage of anybody who wants to say they're not this, they're not that, the Spurs could have beat them if the Nuggets could have beat them if, guess what.

Make it to the first round.

Make, make it to the number one seed, and then you don't have these problems.

I'll tell you what, I don't know what the stands gonna look like at the end of the year, but the last game of the season for the Lakers is the Utah Jazz.

Oh, that is going to be fascinating.

Yes, I saw that on the schedule and I was like, Oh, what is that gonna be if the Lakers are trying to get a certain spot?

Although I think the Lakers won't really have control of whether they stay in 3, and I don't think they want 5 because there's no matchup advantage there if you slip from 4 to 5, and you'd at least rather have home court, right?

The Lakers have the Thunder on Tuesday.

They're gonna get boat raced in that game.

They're at the Warriors.

Probably gonna lose.

Steph's back, look good.

It it's in San Francisco.

San Francisco.

That to me was a key part of that home against the Suns, who still have something to play for that they're trying to win.

And then the finale against the Jazz.

So let's say they go 1 and 2.

I'm gonna give them the game against Phoenix, for example, and just say they go 1-2.

Phoenix is a back to back, I think, uh, Thursday, Friday, you're right, um.

So good scheduling knowledge.

So, so let's say they're 1 and 2.

They're going into the finale against the Jazz.

They win the game.

They're the number 3 seed.

They lose the game, they're the number 4 seed.

Interesting.

Well, does Denver, again, does Denver.

Try to if you're Denver, who'd you rather face in the first round, the Spurs or the Thunder?

I think it's more about the second round though.

The 2nd round 20, I would rather play San Antonio in the 2nd round.

You would, I would rather play the inexperienced.

So you want, you want that 3rd spot.

You want the 3rd spot.

OK.

I would.

I don't disagree with you.

I'm just curious.

I think it's an interesting question.

Victor Webayama and the inexperience of the Spurs feel like such a wild card to me.

Either it's gonna totally matter.

And the fact that Victor hasn't played a ton of minutes, hasn't played as many minutes per game as some of these other big stars we're talking about, and then you're suddenly gonna have to have him play that higher number of minutes at altitude is a wild card.

The fact that he hasn't been in that situation before is a wild card.

The fact that the team overall hasn't been in that situation is a wild card.

Also, if that stuff doesn't actually end up mattering, I think he is more dangerous than.

I, I don't know.

I just think it's the argument against the Spurs in the playoffs this year is their inexperience and Victor's minute.

The only argument you can make.

But if that doesn't turn out to matter, I don't know.

So I, I'm, I'm, I love the Spurs team, you know that.

I love Victor as a player, you know that, and I, I think they're very dangerous, and I'm very curious.

I'm saying I'd probably, if I'm Denver and I'm, you'd rather take the gamble.

I'd take the Thunder are known quantity, right?

We know how good they are.

I wanna see Utah.

If there's something on the line for the Lakers there.

I wanna see Will Hardy tell Jaren Jackson to suit up.

Tell Larry Markin to suit up.

Tell all these guys is.

Are you kidding?

It's gonna be great for Utah if they end up wanting to win that game because I don't know what's gonna be on the line for them in terms of the tanking race.

They might not, nothing, right?

They might be that they're not mobile anymore.

So then the Jazz front office says everybody should suit up because then we can prove to the NBA office we're not doing a high profile Sunday night game against the against the Lakers.

We're going.

Going for it again, I will repeat the thing I have said forever, which is if the owners wanted to fix any of these problems, they could fix them, and that is a podcast for another day.

Boom.

Oh, Luca getting the exception, he's gonna get it, right?

He's gonna get it.

Yeah.

Oh yeah, yeah, I don't think the NBA is gonna fight it.

Why would they?

They have the ability to argue against it for everything I've been.

Told it's like he fits the criteria.

He's left to go to Europe.

Why are you, why are you arguing against that?

They wouldn't.

They wouldn't.

That's the point.

Like that was made very clear to me that that he fits the criteria.

It's good for you if the NBA to have Luca in the, yes, they'll fight the Cade Cunningham one.

They're, they're not gonna, they're gonna go to battle.

We're not doing this right now.

We will see you again next week.