Booker T on Brock's Retirement, Reigns vs. Punk, Oba Femi, Trick Williams and Danhausen!

Be careful what you wish for.

That's what I say with with Roman.

Roman is the best wrestler in, in the world right now.

Let's welcome Booker T, two-time WWE Hall of Famer, to the pin down the Sports Illustrated Pro Wrestling show.

And Booker, let's go through LFG.

It's on A&E Sundays at 10:00 p.m. and we know with WWE we just saw so much young talent at WrestleMania shine, but it starts somewhere.

It doesn't start in the ring at WrestleMania.

It starts on the lower levels, it starts with training.

So tell us about LFG and what to expect.

Oh man, it's gonna be, uh, it's gonna be a different, different show this season.

Um, it's been about the, um, competition between the coaches before which I like taking that element out of play and, and making it all about the young guys and the talent and them competing against each other and, but, but, but more, but more so competing against themselves , you know, because, um, it's a, it's a It's, it's, you, you're up against the clock.

Um, the sand in the hourglass is running out.

The time is ticking away, um, for you to actually get your shot.

You know, some guys have been on season one, season 2, and season 3.

we don't want to see those guys on season 4.

OK.

That's just a fact.

So, um, I think, um, this season is gonna be all about sink or swim, cutting the fat.

Um, you know, uh, it's fight or flight time for the talent.

When you got your career started, what would you say was the most humbling early experience that you had in the ring or maybe out of the ring, whatever it would have been that you realized in that moment, I not only have a lot to learn, I'm so far from where I need to be.

You know, I was a sponge in the beginning, you know, but just, I remember my first uh initial reaction to, you know, hitting the ropes, um, and I mean I got in that that ring and I hit those ropes so hard and I, I can't remember how many times I hit them.

And then I, I, I got home and I took a shower and it burned so bad that I, I didn't realize I had ripped all the skin off my back, you know, in those ropes and how hard the ropes were, you know, so it was an eye-opening experience that my body was gonna have to toughen up to this, uh, but I was, I was looking forward to that challenge, hopefully, like these young guys are today.

You see, the athleticism now is at an all-time high.

You look at old school pro wrestling, I would say the in-ring work, the physicality, like the Harley race type of guys seem to shine more than just about anybody back in the old days.

And then you saw the 90s, there was a little bit of both, where it was the old school mixed with the new school, and now it's.

Everything.

You have you, I show speed jumping off the ropes onto a table at WrestleMania.

Logan Paul elevated himself as a YouTube star, but then you still have guys like Gunther that are as old school as it gets.

You have great in-ring performances like CM Punk and Roman Reigns that we just saw put on a masterpiece, and that was about as old school as.

Match as you can hope for.

Not a lot of extracurricular activity outside of maybe a few shots outside the ring.

So when you are going through what makes a great superstar now, is there one or two things that you say stand out, or is it more, bring everything you have and then mature it in the ring and figure things out as you go?

It's a good question.

Um, we got a, we got a boatload of great superstars now, but, you know, just like you just, um, illustrated, um, those, those superstars are playing different roles, OK.

Um, uh, you talk about an I show Speed who comes into the wrestling business and he loves it.

You could tell he loves it.

And he, and he played a certain role, um, jelly role.

Um, he came out and he played a certain role, Logan Paul.

He played, he played a certain role in.

Then you, you talk about Roman and punk, you know, those guys played a certain role and that role was pivotal, um, as far as the way that show went off the air, as far as what people were gonna be remembering.

And, and what people remember was a classic match.

And and that, that classic match.

If the young guys really watching and learning and take heed, they, they realize storytelling is something that never really goes away.

And, and if we could take what we brought to the game back in the day and merge it with what these young guys are doing today, today, I can only imagine the great matches that are on the horizon, you know, for You know, these young guys to be able to go out there and have.

But there again, psychology and storytelling, at the end of the day, um, mixed with what these young guys do is what's gonna save wrestling and keep wrestling alive.

Yeah, that always is the age-old story with wrestling.

What's more important, storytelling or the actual match.

But in reality, the story is the match, but the match is the story.

It works both ways.

When you look at your career, which opponent do you think got the best out of Booker T?

Which opponent, when you took the ring, you entered the squared circle, would you say, no doubt, that was the best opponent I've ever had?

It's really, really hard to say just because I've had so, so many great.

Partners to get in the ring and perform with, um.

It, that, that, that, that's a too hard of a question to really answer just because it's been so many guys that I've been in the ring with that was on my level and a lot of times above my level and I just, I just had to just keep up with them, you know, um, you know, going back to steamboat.

You know, um, working him 20 minutes in in Germany, you know, working Savage, you know, uh, and working Mr.

Perfect, you know, even going back to like when I first started the wrestling business, working Killer Tim Brooks, and, and not having to say a word in these matches and, and then walking out of these matches.

Just feeling like I had been through a master class and, and, and making me feel like, wow, I, I might could actually do this.

That's why I say it's been so many guys that I've shared the ring with that was so much better than I was that taught me, um, throughout that journey, um, it's, it's too hard of a question.

Brock Lesner Potentially just retired at WrestleMania.

It's hard to know, it's wrestling, you can never say never, but when you look at Brock Lesnar, first of all, do you actually believe he's retired?

I mean, why not?

You know, um, it was , it was unexpected.

No one saw it coming.

Normally that, that, that, you know, uh, that's, that's, that's a real feeling, you know, it's, it's time.

Uh, this, this is that moment.

You know, he might be feeling that way, he might have been feeling that way, um, then.

He may not be feeling that way now though.

You know.

No.

Um, like I said, if the right, if the right dollar, um, uh, figure come along, of course, you know , 5 minutes, I can give you 5 minutes.

You know what I mean?

The retirement will be over with just like that.

Uh, but, but as far as what Brock Lesnar has given to the business and what he's done for the business.

Um, I don't think he has anything left to prove.

Um, Brock Lesnar's been champion many, many times over.

He's made a boatload of money.

His name is, you know, um, etched in stone as far as the wrestling business goes.

Um, I don't think he has to really, really put on a pair of boots to, uh, ever again to make money, you know what I mean?

So, uh, and at this stage, I, I don't think that's what it's, it's about.

Uh, it's about.

You know, I, I think it's about his daughter being able to, you know, see her, you know, do her thing, give her her, you know, time to shine opposed to being in that spotlight.

It's, it, it could be so many variables going into why Brock Lesnar is walking away, but I say if he is walking away, brother, enjoy the fruits of the labor cause it actually feels It's good.

Not to have to wake up and go do that on a monthly basis, you know, to get back at, to see the young guys come up and do their thing like Obafemi passing the torch to Obafemi.

How great was that and how honorable it was for Brock Lesnar to go out there and do that in the middle of the ring, looking up at the lights, 123, without, without any qualms about it.

That's a true professional, you know what I mean?

So Brock Lesnar, um, if, if it's true.

I say, uh, I commend him and congratulations on, you know , you know, his future endeavors.

Yeah, an absolute Hall of Fame career.

And you mentioned Obafemi.

He was one of, if not the star of the weekend in terms of his star rose, I would say higher than anybody when you look at what he came going in and what he finished leaving the ring, knowing he defeated Brock Lesnar.

But then he called out Roman Reigns, and then Roman Reigns responded to Oba Femi.

So I guess my rapid-fire type of quick question here would be, if Oba is in the ring with Roman at some point sooner rather than later, who are you taking?

Be careful what you wish for.

That's what I say with with Roman.

Roman is the best wrestler in, in the world right now.

He really is.

He's truly the best wrestler in the world, bar none, hands down, without any shadow of a doubt.

He really is.

Uh, you can, you can name his last 1011 opponents.

And all of them have had great matches and all of them came in and, and, and left that match better than they was before, before they came in.

That's just what type of guy Roman is.

He's not, he's, he, he haven't had a bad match since he's been in that, at that main event level.

Not too many guys can go out and do what Roman does.

What he did with Punk was, was masterful.

That's why I say Obafemi might want to wait a little bit before you think about, you know, running up.

Attached that right there because, uh, like I said, you gotta be careful what you wish for.

Is Roman, would he be the number one guy of a wrestler you wish, like if you can have a match with any current WWE superstar that you've never had a match with, would it be Roman Reigns on the big stage?

In my prime, you know, in my prime, Roman definitely would have been the guy because he's, he's the bar.

He really is.

And, and, and I don't say that it's not hyperbole or anything like that when I say Roman Reigns is the best wrestler in the world.

He really is.

And, and, and I say that because I got a really, really keen eye on as far as talent goes and, you know, the, the, the IQ of that talent.

And when I watched that guy go out and do it, man, I, I, I, I don't know what, how the match would have gone between him and I, but I , I definitely would have, uh, loved matching wits with Roman Reigns.

Now, you just called him the best in the world.

CM Punk is a self-proclaimed best in the world.

They had it , as we said, a masterpiece, a five-star classic.

But now CM Punk isn't the champ anymore.

He has done just about everything you can do in the business.

What's next for CM Punk?

Well, I mean, if you listen to punk, punk said he's not gonna retire anytime soon.

He's in the game and he's in it for the long haul, um, his body can't do it anymore and I, I get it.

I totally understand that.

You know, but it, it was one of those moments to where, you know, on, uh, on Sunday night, you know, people say, man, punk.

You know, he's, he's been the best in the world, you know, uh.

He's, he's great, you know, um, in, in the ring, you know, but.

You know, we don't know if he can go out there and get it done, but, you know, Pumpkin, you know, he may not have been that great on that night, but he could, he could still pull it out, you know, in the future.

I mean, it, it just may not have been his night, you know.

That's just part of the game.

Sometimes you come in and you just don't have it.

And, and, and, and for me, that was the story at the end of the day.

The story was such a great story, uh, being told, um, that, that, you know, to go to sleep, you know, I got it one time, boom, if I could just get it one more time, but tonight his body just did not have it in him.

Doesn't mean he didn't, you know, um, he's not great.

He just couldn't be as great as he, you know, possibly could have been on that one night.

You know, so, definitely, um, I see Sam Punk, you know, coming back and redeeming himself and going out there and doing some more great stuff.

Um, I, I say Sam Punk may have had that same, uh, Omen that I had, you know, for, for many years, you know, we've heard about the story about Punk wanting to be in the main event of WrestleMania.

That was, that's, that was the reason Punk left, uh, WWE because he wanted to be in the, the main event of WrestleMania.

And I said that, you know, when I was coming up, I said, man, I wanna be the, I want to be in the main event of WrestleMania.

And then I got a chance to be in the main event at WrestleMania against Triple H.

And I always say, I wish to be in the main event, but I didn't wish to win.

That was my problem.

Maybe that was Sam Punk's problem.

He wished to be a debate event.

Hey, when it, when it comes to WrestleMania though, you look at the moments, even Shawn Michaels is referred to as Mr.

WrestleMania.

He had more losses than wins on the big show.

So sometimes it's about performance.

We did see Monday night though, CM Punk confronted Cody Rhodes.

Cody Rhodes said, you just have to ask me when.

And I'll give you a title shot.

So that could be one going forward, Cody and CM Punk, which would be great because they've, they were at WWE together, they were elsewhere together, now they're back together.

But you mentioned just star power.

We have to talk Trick Williams.

Got the US championship.

He's a guy that's very much on the ascension in the world of WWE.

When you look at a talent like Trick Williams, is the sky the limit?

He's got the ball, and he's got to score.

Um, this is just the beginning.

You know, Trick Williams has got a lot of hype behind him right now, but this is where the work really starts for Trick Williams because now he's the champion.

Now he's the in-ring general.

Everything goes through him.

There's mistakes that's gonna be made.

He's gonna get the blame for it.

So now this is where Trick Williams really have to hone in on his craft, you know, of course, the, the, all of the, um, the, the, the smoke and mirrors and the glitter and the, the bright lights, all of that is cool.

Um, but now Trick Williams really has to hone in on his, his, his, his in-ring performance.

Moments every time because what you do outside of the ring, you know, it's, it's all gravy, but at the end of the day, the people are gonna remember how they felt when you walk out of that ring.

And, and, and I say that, you know, the John Cena effect.

You know, people, you know, when John Cena came out, you know, the people looked at John Cena in the middle of that ring and they would always go.

You know, let's go Cena, Cena sucks.

Let's go Cena, Cena sucks.

But at the end of that match, every time those people behind Cena, you know, because He was that guy that knew how to be a general, and now Trick Williams is in that same position.

He's got to take the ball, he's got to run with it, and he's got to score every time he touches it.

So, um, no, it's a very, very pivotal position for, for Trick Williams right now, but I'm, but I'm pulling for him 100%.

I, I told Trick a long time ago, you don't have to be the best wrestler to be the best wrestler, and that's what he's done.

And then you look at Monday night, another star who came up, Saul Ruca, she took on Liv Morgan, put on a great show, but then also this week, she took a bump and a hard bump in the ring.

What do you talk to talent about when it comes to those high spots, when it comes to taking risks?

Because as we know, everybody's body has a clock.

Everybody can only go through so much punishment.

But more so than ever, we're seeing superstars elevate athleticism, try the high spots, execute the high spots at a high level, but sometimes the risk might not be worth the reward.

When you break down the talent, how do you go about addressing when it's the right time and when it's not the right time for those type of, you know, high-end, high caliber, high athletic moves.

Man, that's a, that's a hard question, you know, knowing, knowing when or when not to pull the trigger on, on a, a move like that.

Um, I was there, um, with Soul Ruca and uh right there up close and personal.

I saw it happen right before my very eyes and, and, and it was a really, really gnarly, gnarly bump.

It, it was one of the most gnarliest bumps I've seen in quite some time.

And that's gonna be, that's gonna be a, uh, it's not gonna be, that's not gonna be on the talent.

I mean, um, situation like that, it's not, it's never gonna be on the talent.

It's gonna be up to us to figure out how to put the talent in.

Better positions not to be in harm's way if something like that is gonna happen.

Um, because one thing about this thing, it's not ballet.

One slip, one slip, that's all it takes in this business for your career to be over.

So I just feel like, um, that's gonna be on us, you know, as, um, you know, the managers and the producers and the directors to make sure we make better decisions.

Um, as far as that go, because, you know, so Ruca's going to the main roster.

We don't want her to go, we don't want it not to be able to go to the main roster on her last night, you know, in NXT.

So it's gonna be up to us to make better decisions.

We are here with Sports Illustrated.

We know there's so many iconic SI covers.

Right now, which current superstar would you say, if they're going to be one superstar on the cover of SI, who would it be to represent the WWE?

Trick Williams.

Without a shadow of a doubt.

He's that hot.

You know what I mean?

I mean, I'm serious.

Sir Williams, he's, he's white right now.

I'm serious, man.

Um, and, and it's, it, it, there's nobody really, you know, pulling the numbers like Trick.

You hear when, when you walk out of that curtain, you, you, you, you, you see a star, man.

You see a megastar.

And that's what I love, uh, about, you know, what's going on and what I'm seeing right now with the wrestling business is booming almost like, you know, it was back in the day.

I, I wanna see.

Every guy come out of that curtain, get that same reaction like Trick Williams, you know, so I'm looking for all the stars, you know, the young guys to step up their game and really try to figure out what, what, what is he doing, um, differently than I'm doing.

You know what I mean?

I gotta figure it out, you know, so that's, that's what I did back in the day.

I was studying, you know, so, but for me, it'd definitely be Trick Williams.

Couple of other kind of rapid-fire questions here.

Logan Paul, he's clearly a star of stars in many facets.

Do you expect him to be a future world champion, and is it soon, if you do think he'll get there?

You know, uh, it's kind of crazy for me to be saying this, but I do feel like, um, Logan Paul could be the WWE World champion .

I really feel like, you know, being put in the right position with the right, um, angle at the right time with the right guy.

That, that's, that's, that's why, that's the, that's the only way it could really happen properly.

With, um, Logan Paul.

But, but then, you know, I always say once you get the title, it's about defending it.

Go out there and defend it.

And then once you defend it, you become truly a champion.

And then the rise of Logan Paul really could be etched in, in WWE, you know, you know, annals of time, you know, if done properly, but it's gotta be done right and it's gotta be done with the right guy.

And then lastly, before we wrap, Dan Han's an overnight sensation.

He's selling about as much merch as anybody.

If you had to pick one wrestler for Dan Han to curse next, who would you want it to be?

Um, who would I want it to be?

Um Uh, Robert Stone.

Paralyze him forever.

Oh, Dan Han, what a gift he is.

Great performance at WrestleMania with John Cena and the Miz and Kit Wilson.

That's gonna do it.

Booker T, thank you so much for coming on the Pin Down for Sports Illustrated, and once again, check out WWE LFG.

It's on A&E Sunday nights at 10 o'clock.